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 Bodybuilding for the Beginner!

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MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 28 September 2004 16:27
hey i dont know how to do dips for chest, is my chest day overworking my triceps?
i havent gained a lot of triceps since i started... neither did i on the chest... my legs took it all i think..

should i drop an exercise?
if so, which one..

thanks a lot

[edit] i just worked out my pecs and tri's and my tri's got a big pump and i didnt feel dead at the end this time (no more power in arms)... it might be okay now then
<message edited by MuscleBob on 28 September 2004 17:28>

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Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 29 September 2004 13:09
what's your current routine (to the rep & set?) for chest?

Also when dipping for chest you flare your elbows to the side (not to bend towards your back) lean forward and concentrate on contracting your chest to perform the lift over and above your triceps and shoulders that should come into the movement more at the halfway point.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 04 October 2004 05:09
i currently try to lift my feet as high as i can in my back and it seems to work much much better for my pecs...
last work-out:
Bench 145 lbs 4x6
Dips 4x7
DB fly 25lbs 4x8
Skull Crusher's 75lbs 3x6
Close-Grip bench press 105 lbs 4x6

And my skull crusher was kinda not so well done so it will stay the same next week, everything else is increasing..

One more question:
If I find my squat a bit easy on 145 lbs should i increase weigth by 5 10 or 15?
Seems like 5 would be a breeze 10 about ok but 15 could be possible i think...

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 04 October 2004 16:23
the routine looks fine and if you're gaining then it's working. The thing to remember is to concentrate on the pecs performing the work during the lifts. The tri's will exhaustr quickly though being a smaller muscle group.

Start with adding 10kg to the squat. If this is OK and comfortable then add another 5Kg on top of that.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 04 October 2004 16:25
forgot to add. With that chest routine try dropping the close grip bench and just do skullcrushers for 3x sets. See how that works out as your tri's will already be heavily worked from chest.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 05 October 2004 01:02
well i just re-did the routine:
Bench 150 lbs 6-6-6-5
Dips 4x8
DB fly 30lbs 4x8
Skull Crusher's 75lbs 3x6
Close-Grip bench press 110 lbs 6-4-3
well i had so much problem already lifting the bar off the rack on the first try because i felt myself overworking.... so i think it is good idea to drop the close-grip too as it seems all I do is overtrain on it... although i did get a huge pump (relatively, but the biggest i ever had)

You recommend adding 25 lbs at once on the squat?
woah, okay, will do...

and also my chest and tri's didnt get much gain but my legs seem to have taking all the gains (9 pounds since beginning of september) should i worry about the no gain in chest or should I just be happy with the leg gains and think the chest will pick-up once the legs are at a decent size?

I was squatting 95 lbs with pain september 1st and benching 140 lbs....

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 05 October 2004 14:43
Try rthis routine for chest and see how you get on -

Flat Bench - 3x6 reps
Dips for chest - 3x6 reps
Dumbell incline flyes - 2x6 reps
Skullcrushers - 3x6 reps

That should be plenty. How much and how often have you been eating as well.

Also patience is a virtue.... things will become more noticable at around the 2-3 month mark.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 05 October 2004 17:03
seems very good!!!
I need a weight belt for the dips though right?
Need to get one if i do... or i can try for 3x10 next week until I get one...

about food:
Morning: Cereals ( 150g + fill bowl with milk) and 2 glasses of milk (1 with 22g proteins (29*.75))
Diner: 1.5 chicken breast+veggies(carrots+califlower+brocoli), 2 rice cakes
Supper: Either 220g steak+veggies or I eat with my dad a meat meal
Before bed: 250g cottage cheese
And: 150g peanuts and 133g tuna during the period that need it, none of my school day are the same so these 2 change around a lot...

Pre-workout scoop (29*0.75)
Post-workout (legs, tri's and bi's days) 2 scoops and shoulder 1 scoop

My cereals are musli something... bought from a nature shop no sugar added with some nuts in it.. and the morning milk averages to 500-750g

[EDIT2] as you can see this is low in cooking as i study the rest of the time...

[EDIT] I've also started benching when i was 14 at 45 lbs irregularly and last year i benched with 60g proteins per day 3x per week for a whole year and added only 15 lbs on bench in a year... so even the little i gain on i right now is good since im making big progresses elsewhere
<message edited by MuscleBob on 05 October 2004 18:18>

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 05 October 2004 19:35
Diet looks OK though I'd like to see a little more protein when you wake up (whey in water) and also mid morning & mid pm. Basically proteion of some kind every 2-3 hrs.

Other than that keep up the good progress.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 06 October 2004 02:06
ok one more scoop of whey in water at morning!
one in water and one in milk from tomorrow morning!

the peanuts are the mid-am and tuna mid-pm but i just switch them around because i have school morning or afternoon and peanuts looks somewhat better than eating tuna in class, the max i ever spend without proteins is 4 hours and that is on thursday's because i have a 3h30 lab and the time to get prepared and ask questions around it...

also im doing my chip-ups the wide grip toward the wall and not me, is that the rigth way?

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 06 October 2004 09:57
yep. that's right.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

chauncy
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 13 October 2004 19:17
As a beginner is power factor training ala pete sisco worth doing or should it be left to the more advanced so to speak?
Thanks for the excellent guidance so far by the way!
<message edited by chauncy on 13 October 2004 19:18>

FlexMus
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 13 October 2004 20:42
Im having problems finding how to do each of the exercises. Is it possible to have each of the exercises as a hyperlink to how to perform it?

Its hard to find them using these (http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/m_189786/tm.htm)

Thankyou

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 14 October 2004 11:46
It would be much easier if you just told me what exercises you don't know how to do.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 14 October 2004 11:49
personally I'd say when styarting out stick to the basics then look at the alternative methods 5x5, westside, power factor, HST, etc for when you are fully plateaud and gains come to a stop. You need to find out more how your body works, what perfect form actually feel s like and have your muscles and connective tissues adapt to new loads you are putting on it. KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

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FlexMus
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 14 October 2004 20:22
Ok, i'll try to go through them myself and post them here. See how many i get right

Any that are incorrect, or i have left out, could u please correct them?

Here goes:

SATURDAY - Chest/Tri
5 Min warm-up
Dumbell Flat Bench - 4 sets 6-8 reps
Weighted Dips For Chest - 4 sets 6-8 reps (last set to failure)
Incline Dumbell Fly- 4 sets 6-8 reps (last set to failure) (Lay so head is at the top of the bench)
Skull Crushers - 3 sets 6-8 reps (or close grip bench press)
overhead cable presses 3 sets 6-8 reps (last set to fail) (or close grip bench presses)


SUNDAY - Back/Bi
5 min warm-up
Deadlifts 4 sets 6-8 reps (last set to failure)
Bent Over One Arm Dumbell Rows 4 sets 6-8 reps
Lat pulldowns 3 sets 6-8 reps (last set to fail)
(I would prefer you to do chins instead though if you are strong enough to lift your bodyweight)
Barbell Bicep curl 3 sets 6-8 reps
One arm Dumbell Hammer curls 3 sets 6-8 reps


MONDAY
REST & Cardio (30 mins swimming before brekkie approx 40 lengths)

TUESDAY - Delts/traps
5 min warm-up
Seated Dumbell military press (Sit on Bench while executing) - 3 sets 6-8 reps
Lateral dumbell raises (side) 3 sets 6-8 reps (last to fail)
Barbell Shrugs 5 sets 6-8 reps

WEDNESDAY
REST & Cardio (30 mins swimming b4 brekkie)

THURSDAY - Legs & Abs
5 min warm-up
Barbell Squats 4 sets 6-8 reps
Stiff Legged Dead Lifts 3 sets 6-8 reps
Calf Raises 4 sets 8-10 reps (last set to fail)
Weighted Swiss Ball crunches 4 sets 6-8 reps
hanging leg raises 4 sets 6-8 reps
Dumbell side bends 3 sets 6-8 reps

FRIDAY
REST & Cardio (30 mins swim b4 brekkie)

There we are, that took me quite a while!!

If you could help correct these, and then update your front page post, i think it will help us beginners out.
<message edited by FlexMus on 14 October 2004 20:23>

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 15 October 2004 13:47
pretty much covered it all. Just a couple of things though...

Incline Dumbell Bench press - the link shows decline (head below hips). Easy to adjust so head is above hips (no more than 40 degree angle)

Barbell Curl - Your link shows dumbell curl. Same thing though with a straight bar barbell. Remember to keep form strict (no wobbling or swining of the weight)

Good luck mate.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 15 October 2004 18:17
You sy we should practice until we know what is perfect form...
would preacher be better than barbell crl for a beginner then? and i DO have a preacher curl station at home somewhere under a table
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SlimBoySlim
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 15 October 2004 22:21
I'm new here and have been researching bodybuilding on the internet recently because I wanted to start bodybuilding. I have used free weights in the past but I did'nt really know what I was doing, (am I glad I found this site or what!). I plan to start Cashman's excellent sounding beginners routine.

I would like to ask Cashman a couple of questions if a may; I am a student and have a free weights set and a bench in my (crappy) student room. I can't afford to join the gym to be honest and wondered if there are any alternatives to Weighted Dips and Lat Pull Downs?

There also seems to be a variety of ways to perform sit ups (crunches). Do you sit up completely so your torso is close to your thighs or not?

Cheers!

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 16 October 2004 23:10
lat pulldown -> pull-ups (weighted if needed)

as for crunches i bend my back and try to put lift emphasis on the upper abs and bend more in that area, not lifting the whole torso..

and do the side bends, i now have my obliques sticking out very well and give my 12%BF tummy area a good look, even though the waist is wider!
When i get to 8% those will look good!!!

Btw how much weight is an OK side bends?
Im going for 75lbs next week, I seem to have no probs getting my crunches and side bends weight up every week... from 45lbs
<message edited by MuscleBob on 17 October 2004 18:20>
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Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 18 October 2004 15:52
bob, good side bends progress mate and pleased you can see the changes now. Personally I don't side bend presently as my waist thickness is plenty at present. I'd also say stick with strict barbell curls but hold your hands nearer together to tuck your elbows in (almost a standing preacher curl I guess). This puts the biceps under good strain and hits them hard. It also recruits many fibres through the biceps and brachialis which is beneficial to gains. Secret to biceps is not too many sets and strict form. Good luck mate.

Uranus, as bob says chins (you can buy a bar and bolt to the wall for this or I think you can buy one that attaches over the doorway IIRC) for lats. Dips you can always improvise with a couple of really strong backed chairs, etc. If you are at Uni then I would be amazed if they don't have a really cheap gym for students. Unless you have plenty of free space and lots of weight and the right bars then you will soon outgrow it.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

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SlimBoySlim
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 18 October 2004 18:57
Hmmm....this is true. Time to scab some money from my parents me thinks, for a gym membership! Cheers guv.

SlimBoySlim
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 18 October 2004 19:40
oh, I forgot. I have increadibly small wrists, which is not helped by the fact that I have quite large hands, (god damn it), so do you think I should include some wrist curls in the second day of your (excellent) Beginner's Routine or would that be over-doing it?

I think I probably will join the gym at some stage as like you said I will outgrow my free weights set.

Thanks.

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 18 October 2004 21:09
the wrists half closer to the hand has almot no muscle (at least on me!!!) so i would not worry about there

and the first hald the one with the 2 muscles (one on top and under) seems to develop quite well just moving the weights around!
keep your energy for the more important muscle group...
and wait for cashman's, he probably has more knowledge about this!

and just being a beginner weightlifter might be why you have small wrists!
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SlimBoySlim
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 18 October 2004 23:22
Fair enough. Kind of obvoius when I think about it. I seem to be giving myself a reputation as a bit of a dunce! Everydays a school day as they say.

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 19 October 2004 15:16
LOL Uranus... IMHO Bob's right. If you are doing lifts like bench, dips, dead, etc your grip , forearm and wrist muscles & connective tissues will strengthen accordingly.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

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MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 19 October 2004 17:10
hey cashman i posted in the routine forum for my next routine that I will start in a couple of weeks but no one answered

so, i will ask to you because you always gave good advices

Well I am starting week 7 of your program and it will stop at week 12 so I wanna make sure I don't end up without any routine by then so I was thinking about Frankie NY's first mass bulding routine with 3 days of 3 compound exercises 4x6 or 5x5...
1) Is this routine right for me?
2) It seemed like you chose which exercises you wanted for your routine, so im wondering if I should take some exercises that I do on your routine or should I take none of the same, or should I mix?

My current lifts (of last week):
3x6 Bench 155lbs
3x10 Dips 0lbs
2x6 DB incline flyes 30lbs
3x6 Skull Crushers 80lbs

4x6 Deadlifts 155lbs
4x6 bent over db row 65lbs
4-4-1 wide grips chin-ups 0lbs
3x6 bb curls 95lbs
3x6 one arm hammer curl 35 lbs

3x6 bb military press 100lbs
3x6 db lat raise 25lbs
3x6 bb shrugs 245 lbs

4x6 bb squat 170lbs
4x6 SLDL 130lbs
4x6 calf raises 235lbs
4x6 weighted crunches 75lbs
3x6 side bends 70lbs

[EDIT]
http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/explosive_strength%21/m_199601/tm.htm
how can i up my explosive strength!!!
<message edited by MuscleBob on 20 October 2004 02:12>
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chauncy
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 19 October 2004 17:27
Hi

Have just started with free weights and at local gym been at it for about 2 weeks, my primary aim is to increase my size and have some sort of visable muscles rather than a worzel gummage frame!
My secondary goal is to increase my fitness and endeurance, at this point im concerned that all the cardio work im doing at the gym (lots of running, cross training, rowing, swimming etc) is going to hamper my progress in developing muscles.
I know a few people who seem to know bits and bobs about this and that and i seem to be getting more confused with some advice saying lay off all cardio to build muscle and others saying that cardio will give me more definition (do i need to worry about this after 2 weeks?!)
Both are long term goals but personally at the moment i would prioritise muscle development if i had to make a choice between that and cardio.
As you can see im one mixed up kid!!
Any ideas??

C

cliff_vtr
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 19 October 2004 17:50
Try doing CV on different days to weight training and make sure you eat well and you should be fine
67.4K BW
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chauncy
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 19 October 2004 18:00
I think i'll do that, im going to give my self a decent period of time training one way before i consider changing again. I do tend to jump at new info!

Cheers

CPT11
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 20 October 2004 09:24
Hi,

What is the realistic time frame for one to see results?

I'm 44, 5'10", 170 lbs, 42" chest, 33" waist and 14" biceps. I find my biceps too skinny for my broad frame - imagine Wesley Snipes or Stallone with arms like smaller than Pierce Brosnan's.

I've been working out for almost 4 months now, using a routine similar to Cashman's. I'll be starting Cashman's routine to break the monotony. I've also been eating clean, lots of protein shakes and no fried food.

My waist line has gone down from about 35" and I can see hints of the 6 packs. There are also more muscle definitions on the pecs, delts, biceps and triceps. My stamina has also improved.

But my arms just don't seem to get bigger! How do I get arms like Snipes or Stallone? How long do I have to wait? 1 year? 3 years? 5 years?

Is it advisable for me to use an Arms Prioritize Routine which consists of 2 sets each for the biceps and triceps, and 1 set each for the rest of the body, working each set to failure 3 times a week?

Thanking you in advance.

CPT11

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 20 October 2004 19:29
Stallone probably was on steroids and worked out for a damnnn long time!!!

And remember more is less sometimes with the arms...
I actually reduced following cashman's advice the number of sets and exercises on chest day and seemed to gain better that way, so dont try to pound them in submission!

Well how much time if takes, that is tricky, i wouldnt know, im still waiting after 6 weeks and a half
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Geoffrey the Thin
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 20 October 2004 20:05
Hi Everyone, just joined today. First of all, I am an ectomorph in the truest sense of the word, as I am 6' (183cm), and about 130lbs (59 kg). Although I've always naturally been very thin, part of this is also due to the fact that I do long-distance running (10-12km) 2-3 times per week.
I would like to put on about 20lbs of muscle or so, but I don't want to sacrifice any of my running workouts or endurance, since they are something I do on a competitive basis as well. Since putting on weight of any kind is difficult for me, will it even be possible if I continue running as I do? And if I can put some weight on, will my endurance necessarily suffer as a result? Thanks in advance.

-Geoff

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 21 October 2004 02:57
wow your advice for bb curl really worked, i lowered the weight 5 pound but i will continue with that 5 pound less 1 more week to get my form to the best!!!

i also got a huge wrist pump from this, it was weird!!!
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Sir Noel Plum
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 21 October 2004 23:19

ORIGINAL: Geoffrey the Thin

Hi Everyone, just joined today. First of all, I am an ectomorph in the truest sense of the word, as I am 6' (183cm), and about 130lbs (59 kg). Although I've always naturally been very thin, part of this is also due to the fact that I do long-distance running (10-12km) 2-3 times per week.
I would like to put on about 20lbs of muscle or so, but I don't want to sacrifice any of my running workouts or endurance, since they are something I do on a competitive basis as well. Since putting on weight of any kind is difficult for me, will it even be possible if I continue running as I do? And if I can put some weight on, will my endurance necessarily suffer as a result? Thanks in advance.

-Geoff


Several points to make here:
1) 20lbs of muscle will likely be very difficult for you to put on whether or not you continue with your running. The amount you run is not excessive and as long as you raise your calories high enough my personal view is that your genetics will prove a bigger hurdle than the running.
2) Now to contradict myself, it is possible that a combination of your diet and lifestyle (including your running) accounts for your 130lbs and it could be that, rather like someone escaping a concentration camp, simply increasing your calories would bring you to a higher sedentary level of musculature even in the absence of resistance training.
The only way to know is to 'suck it and see' and do the weights, eat a lot more and monitor monitor monitor. Monitor your weight (it must go up, if not eat more); monitor your dimensions (circumferences of limbs/ chest/ waist etc); monitor your bodyfat and see whether you are putting on mainly muscle or just getting fatter LOL!
3) My belief is that putting on 20lbs will adversely affect your running whether you like it or not. Ever wondered why marathon runners have skinny legs and yet marathon wheel chairers (probably not the right term there) have large arms? Leg muscles are large and can utilise more oxygen than the cv system can mobilise - more leg mass can't help your running because there isn't the oxygen available to make use of it. Arms are smaller and the cv system can easily utilise extra arm muscle in a way it can't with the legs. The point of telling you this is just to point out that the extra weight you will be running with is more or less dead weight over longer distances because the extra leg power cannot be utilised as oxygen is the limiting factor not muscle mass (muscle fibre type issues aside).

I think you need to make a decision right here and now whether you want the extra 20lbs or your present level of running. or look at the following longer term goal:

At 12k 2-3 times a week I gather your competitiveness is at a lower standard and I'm sure that, unless you are extremely ectomorphic given your present very light weight if you could put more weight on you could actually keep your running standard up by doing a little more running. Make no mistake, the running won't make your weight gain/ maintenance any easier but then a target weight of 155-160lbs (allowing for some fat gain as well) for a 6 footer is still fairly modest and if you get all the aspects right over the longer term should be a reasonable goal IMO.

SNP.
<message edited by Sir Noel Plum on 21 October 2004 23:21>

Geoffrey the Thin
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 23 October 2004 14:40
Thanks for the advice. And yes, my running is more casual than competitive. Competitive to me means finishing in the top 20 of a couple of local 10k races each year, so I'm not at the olympic level or anything! But it's still something I like doing and which I try to improve at each year.

I knew it wouldn't be easy, but like you say, for someone of my height, getting to at least 150 should be within reach. I'll see what I can do. Thanks.

-Geoff

cobramaximus
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 23 October 2004 14:42
I duno y but this is the first time I ever looked at this post.

Geoffrey the Thin
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 23 October 2004 16:33


ORIGINAL: cobramaximus

I duno y but this is the first time I ever looked at this post.



? I don't know what you mean.

MuscleBob
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 23 October 2004 21:22


ORIGINAL: cobramaximus

I duno y but this is the first time I ever looked at this post.


its the first one i ever looked
Das monstrum in mir wird explodieren!

Cashman
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RE: Bodybuilding for the Beginner! - 25 October 2004 14:32


ORIGINAL: MuscleBob

wow your advice for bb curl really worked, i lowered the weight 5 pound but i will continue with that 5 pound less 1 more week to get my form to the best!!!

i also got a huge wrist pump from this, it was weird!!!


I'm not just a pretty face
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"... Friedrich Nietzche

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/Bodybuilding_for_the_Beginner%21/m_2245/tm.htm

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