Formula 1 2009 season

cu3ed


Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

Yes, and Jenson was in a slow car for the past however many seasons!

Anthony Davidson was on Five Live before the season started, saying how all the drivers are really excellent drivers and the main difference between them comes down to the cars.
The presenter was really put out, saying "So are you saying Lewis didn't win because he was the best driver, but because he had the best car?".

Basically, all the drivers are very good but you need the car to win. Jenson didn't have it last season, Hamilton and Massa did.
How does that make Jenson a worse driver?

Just to bring up what was said earlier about the rain, the race has started at the same time for the last 10 years since the sepang track opened!

Now the problem may not be the time of day at which it starts but the time of year because 2001 saw it moved from the end of the calender to the start maybe that has something to do with it. The start of the season might be rainy season for malaysia.

But even at that the last time there was heavy rain was 2001. So in the last ten years of them racing at this time there has been two times of extreme rain and one red flag. You cant decide to change the time on that evidence.

wato19


Just to bring up what was said earlier about the rain, the race has started at the same time for the last 10 years since the sepang track opened!

Now the problem may not be the time of day at which it starts but the time of year because 2001 saw it moved from the end of the calender to the start maybe that has something to do with it. The start of the season might be rainy season for malaysia.

But even at that the last time there was heavy rain was 2001. So in the last ten years of them racing at this time there has been two times of extreme rain and one red flag. You cant decide to change the time on that evidence.

no it started 2 hours later than it has ever started

http://news.asiaone.com/News/Latest%2BNews/Sports/Story/A1Story20090406-133663.html

Varg

cu3ed


Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

Yes, and Jenson was in a slow car for the past however many seasons!

Anthony Davidson was on Five Live before the season started, saying how all the drivers are really excellent drivers and the main difference between them comes down to the cars.
The presenter was really put out, saying "So are you saying Lewis didn't win because he was the best driver, but because he had the best car?".

Basically, all the drivers are very good but you need the car to win. Jenson didn't have it last season, Hamilton and Massa did.
How does that make Jenson a worse driver?

Because Jensen never always had a bad car, for 2 seasons he had a tested one of the fastest cars on the track and he managed one win.

Alot like Coulthard in many repects.

Button is the best driver, hes a legend as well. I became an instant fan when they was doing some car show thing on the BBC and he thrashed it up some gravel track in a clio sport and then did a load of dohnuts at the end, covering everyone in dust.

He got a bollocking and just didnt care, plus he smiles a lot and seems like a nice down to earth bloke. His dad is a legend as well, nice friendly jokey bloke.

Now Hamilton on the other hand is a smug, lying tw*t and his dad is a t*sser as well.

I so hope Button wins this season, i said to my mate though hes got to win a lot of the earlier races because Ferrari and McLaren will start winning races as the season goes on.

I HATE HAMILTON

cu3ed




I player doesnt update till after the rerun on BBC, and the red button doesnt have the same options of Virgin for some bloody reason.

And yes, its gonna take a hell of alot to happin for me to believe that Jensen is as good as MAssa Alonaso Hamilton etc etc.

Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

And when the rear diffuser appeal get finalised and they are all the same?

im on virgin, and it works fine for me.  Yesterday i had the sports multiscreen on and had at least 3 options for the F1 GP.
 
Racing is a team sport, the driver is just a part of it.  You cant say that button is only doing well because everyone else is in a crap car.
 
Were it hamilton racing you would be saying its because hes a good driver not because everyone else is in a crap car.  and the ferraris arent as far off as your making out, their performance yesterday was down to their own decisions.  Ferrari had a competitive car yesterday, as did renault.
 
ferrari, mclaren, williams had enjoyed years of having the best cars.  were you slating their drivers for winning when they had the best cars?  the ferrari in the schumacher years was untouchable.
 
very hipocritical to say button isnt a good driver, its just because he has a good car.  i take it you also think his team mate rubens a poor driver as well then, seeing he has the same car but hamilton consistenly drives faster than him?
 
 
 
 

dazc

cu3ed




I player doesnt update till after the rerun on BBC, and the red button doesnt have the same options of Virgin for some bloody reason.

And yes, its gonna take a hell of alot to happin for me to believe that Jensen is as good as MAssa Alonaso Hamilton etc etc.

Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

And when the rear diffuser appeal get finalised and they are all the same?

im on virgin, and it works fine for me.  Yesterday i had the sports multiscreen on and had at least 3 options for the F1 GP.
 
Racing is a team sport, the driver is just a part of it.  You cant say that button is only doing well because everyone else is in a crap car.
 
Were it hamilton racing you would be saying its because hes a good driver not because everyone else is in a crap car.  and the ferraris arent as far off as your making out, their performance yesterday was down to their own decisions.  Ferrari had a competitive car yesterday, as did renault.
 
ferrari, mclaren, williams had enjoyed years of having the best cars.  were you slating their drivers for winning when they had the best cars?  the ferrari in the schumacher years was untouchable.
 
very hipocritical to say button isnt a good driver, its just because he has a good car.  i take it you also think his team mate rubens a poor driver as well then, seeing he has the same car but hamilton consistenly drives faster than him?
 
 
 
 

I pressed the Red Button on the BBC, and even on the on demand service I got nothing, could it be a reigonal thing?

Ferrari, Renault, Williams and McClaren sure as hell didnt have competitive cars for them, they where the exact same cars from last weeks race as they have, no time in travelling to change and test them, maybe now they have 2 weeks till China they will try and adopt some changes, and thats what im saying, if they regard their cars as off the pace now, whats gonna happin to Button when they all get their "on" cars?

Alonso is one of the best drivers, but hes not in a competing car, its has no grip like the others are suffering, doesnt mean I think he is any less of a driver, jsut because Button gets a break in a decent car when the big teams are doing somthing wrong or are doing crap, in what has been only 2 races so far, doesnt mean hes suddenly a better driver.

AS i said, their have been season where Button has been in a pole position car with Honda and wasnt able to pull it out of the bag.

What, do yas think he just woke up this season and thought, " i suppose ill try this time".

And Barricello is a number in the team, jsut like every onther 2 car team.

Tho he is the best driver to never have won the championship.

cu3ed

Varg

cu3ed


Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

Yes, and Jenson was in a slow car for the past however many seasons!

Anthony Davidson was on Five Live before the season started, saying how all the drivers are really excellent drivers and the main difference between them comes down to the cars.
The presenter was really put out, saying "So are you saying Lewis didn't win because he was the best driver, but because he had the best car?".

Basically, all the drivers are very good but you need the car to win. Jenson didn't have it last season, Hamilton and Massa did.
How does that make Jenson a worse driver?

Because Jensen never always had a bad car, for 2 seasons he had a tested one of the fastest cars on the track and he managed one win.

Alot like Coulthard in many repects.

his first season he finished 8th, beating other drivers with much more experience, his second season with bennetton didnt go well (he was put there by williams btw).  he took a respectable 7th in 2002, hardly a poor performance, considering 3 teams had better cars.  9th in 2003 at BAR, better than his teammate.  2004 he scored points in ever race (except the ones he didnt finish) and took 10 podiums, finished 3rd, in a car that was far from the best. 9th in 2005, his teammate didnt even score a point.  then 3 seasons with a truly hopless honda car, that had poor reliability, no real backing and zero progress. 
 
oh, and a couple of times i think its you who has slated him for leaving williams as they gave him his break.  He didnt leave them, they put him out to other teams under contract, he was still under contract with williams untill 2006 when he paid them to release him.  untill then they were getting paid for him.

Umm I dont think I did say that, tho he did pay them 9Mil to get out of his contract.

Plus, arnt they one of the teams running the larger Diffuser?

cu3ed


I pressed the Red Button on the BBC, and even on the on demand service I got nothing, could it be a reigonal thing?
Alonso is one of the best drivers, but hes not in a competing car, its has no grip like the others are suffering, doesnt mean I think he is any less of a driver, jsut because Button gets a break in a decent car when the big teams are doing somthing wrong or are doing crap, in what has been only 2 races so far, doesnt mean hes suddenly a better driver.

AS i said, their have been season where Button has been in a pole position car with Honda and wasnt able to pull it out of the bag.

What, do yas think he just woke up this season and thought, " i suppose ill try this time".

And Barricello is a number in the team, jsut like every onther 2 car team.

Tho he is the best driver to never have won the championship.

the honda car had the odd race where it could ALMOST compete at the front.  but it was far from consistent. 
 
you keep naming other drivers that are 'better' in your opinion.  lets look at 2004 season.
 
schumacher won it, rubens was second (a driver who button has consistenly been better than as his teammate).  BUTTON was third.
 
alonso was 4th 26 points behind, massa was 12th.
 
his teammate was 8th, despite having the same car.
 
i dont think he woke up and thought ill try today,  i think that your forgetting how much sucess he has had, just because he hasnt placed first in races.  i think you overestimate how good the brawn car is, and overestimate how bad the other cars are. 
 
take a look at the fastest lap times set by all drivers in all cars, quite a few people have had lap times just as good as button.  they are just lacking consistency.
 
and you talk like the brawn car is as good as it can get,  do you think they have stopped working on improving it?? 

cu3ed


Umm I dont think I did say that, tho he did pay them 9Mil to get out of his contract.

Plus, arnt they one of the teams running the larger Diffuser?

no worries mate, i thought it was you that had it as a reason for not liking him, cant be bothered looking through 12 pages to find out who it was!  lol
 
on the subject of there only being a week between races and the teams having no time to make improvements, thats not quite true.  renault for example were running a new triple diffuser this weekend,  look at what they were doing on the grid to stop people looking at it!!!  (even though there were plenty of photos of it lol)
 
all the cars will have made changes since last week. even when they are racing there is a large portion of the team developing new parts at the team HQ

Well, jsut reading now that the other teams will be using the double rear diffuser and swap them in time for the China race, its gonna be interesting if they can ansewer it.

I really dont think im over estimating how much the other teams have mucked up on teh diffuser front, can you really beleve that Jensen got THAT good from the geck-go this season and Massa and th rest of teh front runners just got worse by that much?

cu3ed, about the red button.
It may depend on whether you have an interactive box or not.

In my living room I have an interactive set and the red button thingy works.

In my bedroom I have a non-interactive box and it doesn't.
Doesn't matter though, as the red button is just a short cut to one of the digital channels, which are channels 301 and 302 for BBC.
Try typing in those numbers.
That's what they are on Freeview anyway, may be different on Virgin but they should still be there!

cu3ed


Well, jsut reading now that the other teams will be using the double rear diffuser and swap them in time for the China race, its gonna be interesting if they can ansewer it.

I really dont think im over estimating how much the other teams have mucked up on teh diffuser front, can you really beleve that Jensen got THAT good from the geck-go this season and Massa and th rest of teh front runners just got worse by that much?

i dont think he got that good or that the other drivers got that bad, i think hes always been as good as the other drivers you mention, just hasnt had a car capable of being competitive.  The last time he had a truly competitive car was 2004, when the only people to beat him were schumacher and rubens .  alonsa and massa were well down the field that year.  At that time the ferrari was by far the best car on the grid, miles ahead of all the other teams.  the rest of the field was much more evenly matched, and button was consistenly placing in the points and on the podium

dazc

cu3ed


Umm I dont think I did say that, tho he did pay them 9Mil to get out of his contract.

Plus, arnt they one of the teams running the larger Diffuser?

no worries mate, i thought it was you that had it as a reason for not liking him, cant be bothered looking through 12 pages to find out who it was!  lol
 teams

Iirc, that was me. I was pointing out that until he got the go ahead from Brawn, he was about to spend the year on scrap heap... Something which could have been avoided of he hadnt bought himself out. I was pointing out that in hindsight it was the right thing to do as he would be where is now (at the front ) if he didnt.
I still dont like him, i dont think i will but my dislike for the guy is  lowering. Im liking the way the other teams and Hamilton in particular have no answer to a car that shouldnt have even been in the championship to begin with, based on last years p1ss poor performance.

there is just something about button that i really like, i think its the fact that he expresses himself.  At the moment you can clearly see how much hes loving racing and being in the team hes in.  Its not something you see from many of the drivers.

the car is entierly down to ross brawn, and his ability to get a team to work and produce whats needed.  And with 250 less staff members than last year as well, that shows how lacking direction they were under honda.  brawn will continue to drive the team forward, with the financial backing of the virgin brand, and the drive and positivity that branson brings.  I bet the brawn team is a very exciting place to be right now.

the car is entierly down to ross brawn, and his ability to get a team to work and produce whats needed.  And with 250 less staff members than last year as well, that shows how lacking direction they were under honda.  brawn will continue to drive the team forward, with the financial backing of the virgin brand, and the drive and positivity that branson brings.  I bet the brawn team is a very exciting place to be right now

Honda had a hell of a lot to do with the car brawn are currently driving, Brawn only took the team over, what, a month ago. All the earlier developements, improvements and investmenT were via Honda, no?

(I have only skimmed the last couple of pages so I may be missing something)

Varg

cu3ed


Alonso is in a slow car, Massa is in a slow car as Riki, Hamilton, your telling me these teams are just off...in a crap car they where less than a second off pole, whats gonna happin when they come in with new cars 1/3 into the season?

Yes, and Jenson was in a slow car for the past however many seasons!

Anthony Davidson was on Five Live before the season started, saying how all the drivers are really excellent drivers and the main difference between them comes down to the cars.
The presenter was really put out, saying "So are you saying Lewis didn't win because he was the best driver, but because he had the best car?".

Basically, all the drivers are very good but you need the car to win. Jenson didn't have it last season, Hamilton and Massa did.
How does that make Jenson a worse driver?

He would say that! Though I'd like to see him back in F1, maybe replacing Kovalainen. Why would the top drivers get paid so much if any one of 20 drivers could do their job, and some of them pay for their drives with sponsorship.
 
The top drivers get, and keep, the top drives.

dirtyvest

the car is entierly down to ross brawn, and his ability to get a team to work and produce whats needed.  And with 250 less staff members than last year as well, that shows how lacking direction they were under honda.  brawn will continue to drive the team forward, with the financial backing of the virgin brand, and the drive and positivity that branson brings.  I bet the brawn team is a very exciting place to be right now

Honda had a hell of a lot to do with the car brawn are currently driving, Brawn only took the team over, what, a month ago. All the earlier developements, improvements and investmenT were via Honda, no?

(I have only skimmed the last couple of pages so I may be missing something)

as far as i understood it ross brawn was originally working for honda as team director/principal and they had been developing the car for 18 months.  honda then made the decision to pull out of f1 and ross brawn became team owner.
 
i could be wrong im not really sure when he started for them,  but in an interview last weekend, he was being asked about it, and said 'we had been working on the car for 18 months, when honda decided to pull out'  it was in an interview about the new car, how he had become team owner, etc etc.  He did say he originally only joined as team director/principal or whatever the title of his original job was
 
does anyone know for sure how long hes been working there?

Oh, I'm certainly not denying how valuable Ross' input over the past year+ has been, just that it is only very recently that Honda themselves have not been involved and almost all of the funding etc that has produced the car they have ATM was thru (indirectly/directly) Honda.

There is no doubt that he was still an integral cog in that wheel however