Methadrone???

doesnt alcohol kill a higher percentage of its users than ecstasy?

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kaldog


doesnt alcohol kill a higher percentage of its users than ecstasy?

the real problems are when the two are combined, so which one do you chalk that down to?
 
but as massively used as extasy is and has been, its still a tiny figure compared to alcohol.  i dont think people grasp just how different the amount of users is.  its only a small percentage of the population that dont drink alcohol.

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dazc

the real problems are when the two are combined, so which one do you chalk that down to?
 
but as massively used as extasy is and has been, its still a tiny figure compared to alcohol.  i dont think people grasp just how different the amount of users is.  its only a small percentage of the population that dont drink alcohol.

You 'link' it to whichever one you want to ban lol.

E is an interesting one.  The only reason Methadrone is in use at all is because decent E has become much harder to source.  The subsitution effect in action.  Not sure how the effects stack up, but it does sound like Methadrone has worse sides.

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does pure mdma even have many dangers/sides when used moderately and properly?

Current goals: get back in the game
 

Wheels
 
  Not sure how the effects stack up, but it does sound like Methadrone has worse sides.

based purely on what i have seen in mates and people i know, which isnt very scientific, but probably on a par with government research lol, my feeling is that your right.
 
I know people that suffer big comedowns from regular use of e, that feel a bit depressed and lifeless from years of using every weekend.  But ive not seen people i know end up using e for days and days into the working week, to the point where they are pretty much up to the next weekend.  Have seen it with other things like base, but not e.  And the speed with which people are getting to that point with meth seems pretty quick as well.
 
Im sure there are some sensible users, who confine it to the odd night or party, but it doesnt seem the norm among most people i know.  Not like e was back in the day, where people would be weekend warriors.
 
 

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If you're smart enough to:

• Get married
• Vote
• Have a child
• Join the army and kill people

Then you're smart enough to ingest, snort, drink, smoke and generally imbibe whatever you want. Legalize it so its distribution and quality can be regulated thereby eliminating the criminal element.

Of course there are caveats that come to mind:

• You want to take too much. Don't expect free treatment.
• Get into an accident while under the influence, it's your problem.
• Use in the presence of children is forbidden

Just a thought.

Kaizen


If you're smart enough to:

• Get married
• Vote
• Have a child
• Join the army and kill people

Then you're smart enough to ingest, snort, drink, smoke and generally imbibe whatever you want. Legalize it so its distribution and quality can be regulated thereby eliminating the criminal element.

Of course there are caveats that come to mind:

• You want to take too much. Don't expect free treatment.
• Get into an accident while under the influence, it's your problem.
• Use in the presence of children is forbidden

Just a thought.

Great idea. That way kids can go down the shop and buy a load of E like they can a packet of fags? What sort of message is that sending?


Get into an accident while under the influence - it's not just your problem, what about the poor person on the other end of the accident who didn't have anything to do with the drugs? This is afterall the main problem with drink driving. Nobody gives a toss if the drunken twat in the car dies, it's when they kill an innocent bystander that it becomes an issue. 


Your third point seems a) arbitrary b) unenforceable c) pointless. 


I don't want to get into a massive debate about it but you need to look beyond just the quality of the drugs you will be able to buy if it's legalised. Frankly I don't give a toss about the welfare of the people who choose to take drugs. If they want to **** themselves up, go and do it, if you're buying dodgy E or dodgy coke that makes you more likely to die, frankly I still don't give a toss. Legalizing drugs to protect drug users is counter intuitive in my eyes.


Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

^ So you would like to see alcohol banned I take it?

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbIGhfbrlj0
 
 

Wheels

dazc

the real problems are when the two are combined, so which one do you chalk that down to?

but as massively used as extasy is and has been, its still a tiny figure compared to alcohol.  i dont think people grasp just how different the amount of users is.  its only a small percentage of the population that dont drink alcohol.

You 'link' it to whichever one you want to ban lol.

E is an interesting one.  The only reason Methadrone is in use at all is because decent E has become much harder to source.  The subsitution effect in action.  Not sure how the effects stack up, but it does sound like Methadrone has worse sides.

interesting isn't it. I can't touch e's nowadays as they are cut with so much sh!t hence why they cost £2 and they make me really ill, I feel like I've been dipped in acid. So is making something illegal helpful to the end user. I'm not so sure!

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Red Bull


interesting isn't it. I can't touch e's nowadays as they are cut with so much sh!t hence why they cost £2 and they make me really ill, I feel like I've been dipped in acid. So is making something illegal helpful to the end user. I'm not so sure!

There are real problems getting hold of MDMA, but no one seems to know quite why.  It's not that hard to make and it has little to do with law enforcement (dispite what they might claim!).

Perhaps it's just the price fell so far, everyone moved to other things.

A fully paid up spokesperson for Big Oil and board member for the illuminati, posting from a tropical tax haven.  Caution: Posts may not have any moral content.

I'm sure I read somewhere that it was due to the fact that a certain chemical had been banned in China, sorry, a bit vague but i someone here must know what I'm waffling about?

sillynarbie

Great idea. That way kids can go down the shop and buy a load of E like they can a packet of fags? What sort of message is that sending?

That E is no more harmful than a pack of fags.  Which, most people would agree, about right.

Legalizing drugs to protect drug users is counter intuitive in my eyes.

Sometimes the counter intuitive answer is the correct one.  When it comes to social policies, it seems to be the correct answer more often than not IMO.

Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

The Netherlands are not a good example at all.  The Portual model is much better IMO.  Tthe get off your face culture is not in anyway hampered by the existing laws, why would you assume changing them would create anymore of a problem?

A fully paid up spokesperson for Big Oil and board member for the illuminati, posting from a tropical tax haven.  Caution: Posts may not have any moral content.

Wheels

Red Bull


interesting isn't it. I can't touch e's nowadays as they are cut with so much sh!t hence why they cost £2 and they make me really ill, I feel like I've been dipped in acid. So is making something illegal helpful to the end user. I'm not so sure!

There are real problems getting hold of MDMA, but no one seems to know quite why.  It's not that hard to make and it has little to do with law enforcement (dispite what they might claim!).

Perhaps it's just the price fell so far, everyone moved to other things.

Yes, you've hit the nail on the head imo

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drugs dont kill people. people do.

boom

My understanding is that MDMA has been difficult to produce for a couple of years due to some massive seizures of sassafras oil in Cambodia, which is a precursor to MDMA. IIRC, one seizure of 35 tons of the stuff meant that enough MDMA to make over 200 million pills was taken out of the picture. Whilst a lot of drugs might be relatively easy to synthesise, the raw ingredients which are used in their production are monitored internationally.

dazc

kaldog


doesnt alcohol kill a higher percentage of its users than ecstasy?

the real problems are when the two are combined, so which one do you chalk that down to?
 
but as massively used as extasy is and has been, its still a tiny figure compared to alcohol.  i dont think people grasp just how different the amount of users is.  its only a small percentage of the population that dont drink alcohol.

MDMA on its own hasn't caused any deaths iirc. Alcohol certainly has.

People do cane E's days in a row but not all that often. After a few days it stops working anyway and you just go a bit insane. This mephadrone seems to continue to work from what people are saying.

From what it looks like it seems a lot of people who didn't touch "drugs" or illegal drugs at least have got into mephedrone. Same basis to why they think it's ok to get hammered every weekend. Oh it's legal so it's ok. Silly really. I don't mind the stuff getting banned to be honest, sounds pretty nasty sh1t anyway. It's not dangerous in terms of people dropping like flyes but from what i've read it's not too kind on the body. I'm not anti-drug either, i just don't bother with them much anyway as per Reborns statement. They start off fun...never a truer word spoken imo. Massive high at the start and everything is fcuking fantasic and wonderful. Then it's downhill, but it's the ones that don't know when to stop that give a lot of drugs a bad name. Also the world on the likes of LSD/shrooms (very safe drugs in the right frame of mind) is not a world which the goverment wants. It opens your eyes, they like to keep our eyes shut.

For the record,  a lot of alcohol related deaths aren't even recorded as such.

For instance when I had a heart attack brought on by alcohol withdrawl, if I had died it would not have been recorded as an alcohol related death.

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2011

Reborn


For the record,  a lot of alcohol related deaths aren't even recorded as such.

For instance when I had a heart attack brought on by alcohol withdrawl, if I had died it would not have been recorded as an alcohol related death.

Funny tho if you were on any illegal drug it'd be recorded as [insert illegal drug name] related death.

sillynarbie

Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

Ever thought that the UK's "get off your face" culture may be in part a product of our approach to drug legislation?

Just a thought...

tac

sillynarbie

Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

Ever thought that the UK's "get off your face" culture may be in part a product of our approach to drug legislation?

Just a thought...

Thats just crazy talk

A fully paid up spokesperson for Big Oil and board member for the illuminati, posting from a tropical tax haven.  Caution: Posts may not have any moral content.

Wheels

tac

sillynarbie

Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

Ever thought that the UK's "get off your face" culture may be in part a product of our approach to drug legislation?

Just a thought...

Thats just crazy talk

Its even worse with booze and thats legal and easily available.

MT All Round Member of the Year

2011

sillynarbie

 Great idea. That way kids can go down the shop and buy a load of E like they can a packet of fags? What sort of message is that sending?


Get into an accident while under the influence - it's not just your problem, what about the poor person on the other end of the accident who didn't have anything to do with the drugs? This is afterall the main problem with drink driving. Nobody gives a toss if the drunken twat in the car dies, it's when they kill an innocent bystander that it becomes an issue. 

 
I agree with your point above. The death of innocent people under circumstances like this is tragic. It is however something we've been having for decades with drunk driving. There is no difference. Irrespective of the substance taken, driving, operating machinery etc. etc. should all be illegal. 


Similarly, the sale of restricted substances to minors should be illegal with fitting punishment in the event of a transgression. The problem is not the sale of a restricted substance to a minor but rather than the penalty is not severe enough.

sillynarbie
 
Your third point seems a) arbitrary b) unenforceable c) pointless. 

 
I hope not. My thinking around this one is focussed on social responsibility and the inference that taking any controlled substance can have consequences. As an example: You're in the process of divorcing your spouse. You've frequently used in front of your children while your spouse hasn't. Guess who gets the kids? Here's another: Would you send your kids around to play with a friend whose parents are likely to snort a line in front of them?


If we want to be treated as adults we need to act as adults and be accountable for our actions. Please don't quote me corner cases on this one.

sillynarbie
 
I don't want to get into a massive debate about it but you need to look beyond just the quality of the drugs you will be able to buy if it's legalised. Frankly I don't give a toss about the welfare of the people who choose to take drugs. If they want to **** themselves up, go and do it, if you're buying dodgy E or dodgy coke that makes you more likely to die, frankly I still don't give a toss. Legalizing drugs to protect drug users is counter intuitive in my eyes.


Please don't cite the Netherlands laws and other countries that have more liberal drug laws as an example, since the UK has a unique "get off your face/get ****ed up" culture that isn't prevalent in those countries. 

Again, I agree with you on this. If someone wants to shove drain cleaner up their nasal passage, please go ahead with my blessing. My concern is not so much about the quality of the product but more about the crime sub-culture it spawns.

"Wow! you're a plant! No? then why are you snorting plant fertilizer, weirdo."

saw this group on facebook earlier. 70k members. none of which can seem to grasp the concept that mephedrone IS NOT PLANT FERTILISER.

also one person stated that 1 in one mephedrone users have died /o\

ive no problem with the stuff being made illegal, what does get in my tits is how fuc*ing ignorant so many people are when it comes to this and other drugs

Current goals: get back in the game
 

If your taking of meph or meth or whatever it is called is likely to affect me, my life, or that of those I care about, then I support a ban.

If it just leads to self-destruction of people who have no focus or handle on life, then it makes no difference to me if it is banned or not tbh.

What does it do to a taker anyway? make you feel "good" or whack you off your t1ts like a litre of vodka downed in 2 minutes flat?

I have no idea.

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made me violently ill for days and Im a pretty seasoned drug user!

Its all academic, they will simply alter the chemical structure a little and sell it as something else.

MT All Round Member of the Year

2011

"the meow meow dealer son of a labour MP is to be quizzed after 148 bags of the killer drug were seized"

killer drug? theres not even evidence that this stuff has been the cause of a single death.

this is yet another example of media rubbish and sensationalism which gets on my tits :(

Current goals: get back in the game
 

More likely to do harm in the next few weeks as all the sellers cut whatever stock they have got left with all sorts of nasties in order to have one last profit hurrah.

A few of my mates have tried that NRG-1 that the son says 'makes you feel like God for 25p a line'. They certainly didn't feel like God! More like a very heavy caffeine buzz which they soon got sick of.

All these new compounds don't really cut the mustard. The 'old' stuff MDMA, Speed, Acid, Coke works and that is why they have been popular for decades.

I'm here to attain not maintain

meanwhile...

"tragic amy houghton died in her boyfriends arms - hours after her 18th birthday party. Amy, who had only had a couple of ciders, was chatting with pete townson when she stopped breathing.

A Barnsley inquest was opened and adjourned ahead of medical tests after a post-mortem proved inconclusive"

i mean if meph was involved this would be front page headlines, and it wouldnt be 'amy, who had only a line of meph' it would be 'she had been sniffing lines of deadly legal high mephedrone all night!'. and there would be no mention of an inquest or a post mortem, mephedrone would be blamed without question as the sole cause of death.

argh.

Current goals: get back in the game
 

Banning a substance because of the politics catalysed by sensationalised media reports and the ignorant opinions of a lot of people who needed to be told that it wasn't methadone is just simply madness.

It's no wonder that very few people actually take any personal responsibility for themselves and their actions when the government tries to stop you from ever having any.

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commando




a few of my mates have been taking it the past few weekends and none of them could actually tell me what it is lol!

Then  why did they take it?

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ginasmg

commando




a few of my mates have been taking it the past few weekends and none of them could actually tell me what it is lol!

Then  why did they take it?

Cos its better be be high and confused than not high!
 
I got some crazy ecstasy this weekend. Completely bizarre hit, but quite a pleasant one I think! Obviously took about 5 to make sure I enjoyed them!
 
'Banning' it will make very little difference. Dealers will be stocked up to the eyeballs with it in preparation for the ban and even afterwards it will still be avaiable, just maybe not as easily.

The govenment can ban what they like as long as there is money to be made, someone will knock something else up or the current drug will go underground, what this countrys govenment has got to ask is why does its people have a need for drugs that make them happy ???? problem is this country is  rotten through and through from the top to the bottom full of greedy people thinking money will cure all its problems, in this day and age its all about money, what these greedy people fail to realise is you cant take it with you when you leave this world, and other people will try and take what you got. thinking they have a better use for it, some of the happiest people on this planet are the poorest in terms of money but they are rich in life.
If people have the money to buy and take drugs, smoke fags and drink beer, then would it not be better to tell them what could happen to them, and let them get on with it, the govenment rave on about assisted sucide, when they allow advertising to promote said items for profit is it not the same
thing like i said rotten they are all in it just for money dirty stinking money.
 
sorry about that rant over it just make me mad, its all bolloxs

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When will people realise that drugs arn't dangerous. People are dangerous.

I know a guy who smokes crack recreationally, about once a month. He has a girlfriend, a job and is generally doing pretty well for himself. In fact he got engaged a couple of weeks ago. I also know a guy on the dole who does nothing but smoke weed all day. Now we all know that cannabis is the safer drug but the guy who smokes crack is a responsible drug user. The guy who smokes weed, isn't. Drugs are only as dangerous as the people using them.
It makes me sick when i hear of 16 year olds going on 4 day benders ****ing themselves up, not because i care about them or their health, but because it will just make another headline that 'drugs are bad' when in reality its actually the fault of the stupid kid that chooses to abuse the substance. Reccy drugs are no different to steroids. They can be used responsibly, and they can be abused. Why does the responsible drug user have to pay the price of drug abuser?

And in regards to mephedrone. Its a sh1t kiddies drug. MDMA is better and safer in almost everyway.

kaldog


does pure mdma even have many dangers/sides when used moderately and properly?

Pure MDMA is one of the safest drugs out there. When used responsibly in moderation its pretty much harmless.

All4n


Also the world on the likes of LSD/shrooms (very safe drugs in the right frame of mind) is not a world which the goverment wants. It opens your eyes, they like to keep our eyes shut.

So true mate. Its bollocks.

What does a "shroom" open your eyes to that the govt doesn't want you to see?

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kaldog


does pure mdma even have many dangers/sides when used moderately and properly?

Pure MDMA is one of the safest drugs out there. When used responsibly in moderation its pretty much harmless.

All4n


Also the world on the likes of LSD/shrooms (very safe drugs in the right frame of mind) is not a world which the goverment wants. It opens your eyes, they like to keep our eyes shut.

So true mate. Its bollocks.

lol, no it doesnt. it confuses you to think your stupid/simple thoughts are deep and make sence.

shrooms do not make you a philosopher

lolz

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kaldog


does pure mdma even have many dangers/sides when used moderately and properly?

Pure MDMA is one of the safest drugs out there. When used responsibly in moderation its pretty much harmless.

All4n


Also the world on the likes of LSD/shrooms (very safe drugs in the right frame of mind) is not a world which the goverment wants. It opens your eyes, they like to keep our eyes shut.

So true mate. Its bollocks.

lol, no it doesnt. it confuses you to think your stupid/simple thoughts are deep and make sence.

shrooms do not make you a philosopher

lolz

 


Correct, I remember being 15 and on strawberries (acid) at about 5am I decided Id worked the world out and Id never be the same again.. by about 7am I was chucking up in the bog and I think I shat myself while doing it... 

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I can remember on shrooms i thought i'd changed my entire life in my head in 1 night.