BCAA or Glutamine

Hi guys,

I'm new to using supplements for recovery and wanted to know what's better for me.

At the moment I'm doing circuit training which consists of 5 sets of high reps which leaves my muscles depleted and hurt eventhough I can notice gains.

What would you guys reccomend I take? I'll be taking the recovery supps along with my protein shake which I'll be ordering in the next couple of days.

Thanks in advance

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

What about including Beta Alanine and Creatine in your list?

How do they help recovery?? I think they actually work by an action which would mean he'd work out harder.

Although not a fan myself I'd look at the DOMS reductive qualities of BCAA post workout and keeping your protein higher throughout the day. In other words not just the one shake. Old school thinking is, all things being equal, if you're still sore you are either not recovered (so rest more) or need more protein to help repair said worn muscle fibres.

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Wilks


What about including Beta Alanine and Creatine in your list?

I'm already taking creatine!

I want to go for a recovery supplement

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

Mobster


Although not a fan myself I'd look at the DOMS reductive qualities of BCAA post workout and keeping your protein higher throughout the day. In other words not just the one shake. Old school thinking is, all things being equal, if you're still sore you are either not recovered (so rest more) or need more protein to help repair said worn muscle fibres.

At the moment I'm taking mass attack and will be finishing it off soon and then will be loading onto protein.

So you suggest BCAA then?

Any other recommendations?

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

Get yourself some glutamine mate from myprotein.

Cheap as chips 20 quid including delivery on a kg.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

Sorry mate never read the 'recovery' part!!

I saw 'high reps' and lost my prehiperal vision.....

Mobster


How do they help recovery?? I think they actually work by an action which would mean he'd work out harder.

Although not a fan myself I'd look at the DOMS reductive qualities of BCAA post workout and keeping your protein higher throughout the day. In other words not just the one shake. Old school thinking is, all things being equal, if you're still sore you are either not recovered (so rest more) or need more protein to help repair said worn muscle fibres.

I dunno dude, I think this is more common sense thinking than old school and totally agree. 
 
Recovery is a bit ambiguous, is the op totally blown out after each session which would mean loading parameters might need tweaking, is he mildly sore the next day or massively sore which would mean nutrition as a whole might need tweaking?
Either way I think the best of the bunch is BCAA, there's more training based research backing this up, especially the benfits of Leucine, one of the 3 bcaa over glutamine (the burns patient, hmmm, how does critically ill care apply to training....). 
Anecdotally, I 've only seen benefits and doms reduction from supplementing with bcaa; glutamine might be cheap but did squat for my recovery and I've read plenty debunking the myths of Glutamine supplementation as a recovery aid.  Interestingly, when I jacked up my protein intake to 1.5 grams per pound of bodyweight and increased my pre/pwo protein shake to 20-25 grams a serving, that caused a comparable reduction in doms and an increase in recovery as when I was supplementing with bcaa which raises the question do we need bcaa if protein and energy intake is sufficient, hmmmm...

Currently rocking the Caveman Diet...

You dont need a recovery supp like glut or bcaa imo, just make sure your getting enough rest, eating right and not overtraining, ive never used glut or bcaa, just a few samples.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

Gothic_Muscle

Mobster


How do they help recovery?? I think they actually work by an action which would mean he'd work out harder.

Although not a fan myself I'd look at the DOMS reductive qualities of BCAA post workout and keeping your protein higher throughout the day. In other words not just the one shake. Old school thinking is, all things being equal, if you're still sore you are either not recovered (so rest more) or need more protein to help repair said worn muscle fibres.

I dunno dude, I think this is more common sense thinking than old school and totally agree. 
 
Recovery is a bit ambiguous, is the op totally blown out after each session which would mean loading parameters might need tweaking, is he mildly sore the next day or massively sore which would mean nutrition as a whole might need tweaking?
Either way I think the best of the bunch is BCAA, there's more training based research backing this up, especially the benfits of Leucine, one of the 3 bcaa over glutamine (the burns patient, hmmm, how does critically ill care apply to training....). 
Anecdotally, I 've only seen benefits and doms reduction from supplementing with bcaa; glutamine might be cheap but did squat for my recovery and I've read plenty debunking the myths of Glutamine supplementation as a recovery aid.  Interestingly, when I jacked up my protein intake to 1.5 grams per pound of bodyweight and increased my pre/pwo protein shake to 20-25 grams a serving, that caused a comparable reduction in doms and an increase in recovery as when I was supplementing with bcaa which raises the question do we need bcaa if protein and energy intake is sufficient, hmmmm...

Agreed. I've stated that success with L-Glut seems diet dependant. Mine is so rich in both BCAA and L-Glut from the massive amounts of whey I consume along with a (mostly) healthy diet that my adding these in would be a waste or of little additional benefit. Others, however, often fail to reveal just how piss poor theirs are. From 30g of protein only following a workout and then sandwiches for lunch yet claiming (in one case) 'my diet is spot on' to worse.

Almost without fail every time someone actually puts up info on what they do you could drive a bus through the **** ups. I suggested BCAA ONLY because of the many DOMS reduction success stories I've seen. Otherwise he needs to rest more and up his protein. End of. 

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Mobster


Otherwise he needs to rest more and up his protein. End of. 

That's exactly what I was looking for! To find out if I need it or if I don't!

Like mentioned in previous posts, I've been taking mass attack and now will be back on protein (possibly 90+), and I think that might be one problem and the other might be that I only started this routine 2 weeks ago and my muscles havn't adjusted to the high reps I'm doing.

I might just try glutamine (simply because of the price) if the protein doesn't work.

Cheers guys



 

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

Why not try the rest. Costs nothing. Just take an extra day off and see what happens.

OFFICIAL BULKPOWDERS.CO.UK REPRESENTATIVE

 
My Grip book - click here and buy one

Icemansoldier


You dont need a recovery supp like glut or bcaa imo, just make sure your getting enough rest, eating right and not overtraining, ive never used glut or bcaa, just a few samples.

Why are you giving advice on a supplement you obviously have no experience with.
 
Glutamine can be a great addition to a trainers diet.
 
Buy some, use between 15-30g per day,vary the amount on training days to non training days.
 
And see how you get on,if you think it's off no benefit to you then simply do not use it,but if like me you find it to be of great benefit,then you may wanna use it as a regular part of your diet.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

MakaLOLi - i simple explaning none are needed, simple as. Everyone else understood it, funny you didnt.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

Simply do not give adivce on a product you have no knowledge on,it would be more helpful to the OP.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

Why would i suggest for the OP to use it when he may not need it. Ive stated why in above posts.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

Why would i suggest for the OP to use it when he may not need it. Ive stated why in above posts.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

How can you suggest anything when you have no experience on, or with the product.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

Naughty step both of you. Now!!

OFFICIAL BULKPOWDERS.CO.UK REPRESENTATIVE

 
My Grip book - click here and buy one

Guys,

I only wanted some opinions and didn't mean to start an argument

I've decided to test glutamine on my next cycle (start of december)

Cheers for your input

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

Mobster


Naughty step both of you. Now!!

Lol

Zeddy


Guys,

I only wanted some opinions and didn't mean to start an argument

I've decided to test glutamine on my next cycle (start of december)

Cheers for your input

Surprised you've gone for this over bcaa, what made you choose Glutamine?

Currently rocking the Caveman Diet...

makaveli1971 1996


How can you suggest anything when you have no experience on, or with the product.

You would fight with your shadow, your such a laughing stock that loves arguing. Im out.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

Zeddy - the argument wasnt your fault dw about it mate.

Muscle Finesse & Maximuscle Board Rep

Mobster

Gothic_Muscle

Mobster


How do they help recovery?? I think they actually work by an action which would mean he'd work out harder.

Although not a fan myself I'd look at the DOMS reductive qualities of BCAA post workout and keeping your protein higher throughout the day. In other words not just the one shake. Old school thinking is, all things being equal, if you're still sore you are either not recovered (so rest more) or need more protein to help repair said worn muscle fibres.

I dunno dude, I think this is more common sense thinking than old school and totally agree. 

Recovery is a bit ambiguous, is the op totally blown out after each session which would mean loading parameters might need tweaking, is he mildly sore the next day or massively sore which would mean nutrition as a whole might need tweaking?
Either way I think the best of the bunch is BCAA, there's more training based research backing this up, especially the benfits of Leucine, one of the 3 bcaa over glutamine (the burns patient, hmmm, how does critically ill care apply to training....). 
Anecdotally, I 've only seen benefits and doms reduction from supplementing with bcaa; glutamine might be cheap but did squat for my recovery and I've read plenty debunking the myths of Glutamine supplementation as a recovery aid.  Interestingly, when I jacked up my protein intake to 1.5 grams per pound of bodyweight and increased my pre/pwo protein shake to 20-25 grams a serving, that caused a comparable reduction in doms and an increase in recovery as when I was supplementing with bcaa which raises the question do we need bcaa if protein and energy intake is sufficient, hmmmm...

Agreed. I've stated that success with L-Glut seems diet dependant. Mine is so rich in both BCAA and L-Glut from the massive amounts of whey I consume along with a (mostly) healthy diet that my adding these in would be a waste or of little additional benefit. Others, however, often fail to reveal just how piss poor theirs are. From 30g of protein only following a workout and then sandwiches for lunch yet claiming (in one case) 'my diet is spot on' to worse.

Almost without fail every time someone actually puts up info on what they do you could drive a bus through the **** ups. I suggested BCAA ONLY because of the many DOMS reduction success stories I've seen. Otherwise he needs to rest more and up his protein. End of. 

Thats the best bit of advice in the thread - see how much glut you are already getting; if you take supplements a lot you are probably getting enough, it is the most common amino acid after all!     

I know the RDA would vary for L-Glut and BCAA depending on the individual.  Also, the protein type/quality would affect the amount of both these aminos present.

Is there a 'guesstimate' as to how much of each one should consume on a daily basis?  Also, is their a generic figure to work to as to how much your average whey blend contains of each amino?

Gothic_Muscle


Surprised you've gone for this over bcaa, what made you choose Glutamine?

As suggested earlier on in the thread, I don't think I'm getting enough glutamine from my protein shake, in my case mass attack. I'm only taking it once a day eventhough it states that mass attack is high in glutamine peptides.

Also I mentioned I've been doing high reps of excercises only in the last two weeks and think my body hasn't had enough time to adjust.

I'm thinking of getting Boditronics express whey (as opposed to mass attack) and glutamine.

25|5ft 7"|10st 6 - 04/06/10
Bench - 90KG(1RM)
Squat - 110KG(1RM)
Deads - 140KG (3RM)
Zeddy's Journal - CUTTING TIME

Wilks


I know the RDA would vary for L-Glut and BCAA depending on the individual.  Also, the protein type/quality would affect the amount of both these aminos present.

Is there a 'guesstimate' as to how much of each one should consume on a daily basis?  Also, is their a generic figure to work to as to how much your average whey blend contains of each amino?

Most recommend doses of between 20-40g a day of L-Glutamine. Of the amino acids in WPC 18% (typically) comes from Glutamic acid. 

OFFICIAL BULKPOWDERS.CO.UK REPRESENTATIVE

 
My Grip book - click here and buy one

Cheers Mobster mate.

So 100g of WPC per day would equate to 18g of L-Glutamine.  Therefore every 10g of WPC would give you 1.8g of L-Glutamine.  I currently take 4 x 20g scoops so would have an L-Glut intake of 14.4g.

I bow to your knowledge once again mate :)

Zeddy

Gothic_Muscle


Surprised you've gone for this over bcaa, what made you choose Glutamine?

As suggested earlier on in the thread, I don't think I'm getting enough glutamine from my protein shake, in my case mass attack. I'm only taking it once a day eventhough it states that mass attack is high in glutamine peptides.

Also I mentioned I've been doing high reps of excercises only in the last two weeks and think my body hasn't had enough time to adjust.

I'm thinking of getting Boditronics express whey (as opposed to mass attack) and glutamine.

Fair enough, it's cheap enough to give it a go!  Your also getting glutamine and bcaa from whole foods too, Glutamine is pretty abundant in cottage cheese if you eat this?  If you've got your diet set up to give you at least a gram or protein per lb bodyweight your going to be getting a fair bit of both! 

Currently rocking the Caveman Diet...

Icemansoldier

makaveli1971 1996


How can you suggest anything when you have no experience on, or with the product.

You would fight with your shadow, your such a laughing stock that loves arguing. Im out.

People come onto these forums looking for good, or correct advice.
 
It would be more helpful to the OP by not telling him he doesn't need a particular product which you have no knowledge about.
 
You will find Glutamine is supplemented with my most serious trainers, bodybuilders.
 
For me before using Glutamine the DOMS after legs for example were intense,since supplementing with Glut, the DOMS are almost non existent.
 
And my diet is very high in protein.
 
Good product if you ask me and well worth a shot at £20 per kg from myprotein.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

Wilks


Cheers Mobster mate.

So 100g of WPC per day would equate to 18g of L-Glutamine.  Therefore every 10g of WPC would give you 1.8g of L-Glutamine.  I currently take 4 x 20g scoops so would have an L-Glut intake of 14.4g.

I bow to your knowledge once again mate :)

For example, in let's say maximuscle promax.....
 
There is 6.9g of L-Glutamine per 100g of protein.

If you love something let it go,if it comes back to you it's yours,if it doesn't it never was.

Wilks


Cheers Mobster mate.

So 100g of WPC per day would equate to 18g of L-Glutamine.  Therefore every 10g of WPC would give you 1.8g of L-Glutamine.  I currently take 4 x 20g scoops so would have an L-Glut intake of 14.4g.

I bow to your knowledge once again mate :)

Not quite. Of the protein percentage. So WPC 80 is 80g protein per 100g powder and of the 80g 18% equates to 14.4g. Use that figure per 100g powder to get a marker.

Now bow LOL.

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Haha cheers chaps! :)

More to add to the minefield of supplementation! :)

Glutamine.....i think its hot to trott n so do a lot of others that train hard...at the end of the day its quite cheap so try it....if u think its good then carry on....same as anything.
I find BCAAs a bit odd as there is boat loads in a good quality protein shake and buying caps is fooking pricey!
Good protein and Glutamine...throw creatine into the mix n ur good to go!

makaveli1971 1996

Icemansoldier

makaveli1971 1996


How can you suggest anything when you have no experience on, or with the product.

You would fight with your shadow, your such a laughing stock that loves arguing. Im out.

People come onto these forums looking for good, or correct advice.
 
It would be more helpful to the OP by not telling him he doesn't need a particular product which you have no knowledge about.
 
You will find Glutamine is supplemented with my most serious trainers, bodybuilders.
 
For me before using Glutamine the DOMS after legs for example were intense,since supplementing with Glut, the DOMS are almost non existent.
 
And my diet is very high in protein.
 
Good product if you ask me and well worth a shot at £20 per kg from myprotein.

Do you, or anybodyeven, have any evidence/research that glutamine helps releive doms?

Smeagolmalicious


Glutamine.....i think its hot to trott n so do a lot of others that train hard...at the end of the day its quite cheap so try it....if u think its good then carry on....same as anything.
I find BCAAs a bit odd as there is boat loads in a good quality protein shake and buying caps is fooking pricey!
Good protein and Glutamine...throw creatine into the mix n ur good to go!

..and Glutamine comes from....

Currently rocking the Caveman Diet...

Smeagolmalicious


Glutamine.....i think its hot to trott n so do a lot of others that train hard...at the end of the day its quite cheap so try it....if u think its good then carry on....same as anything.
I find BCAAs a bit odd as there is boat loads in a good quality protein shake and buying caps is fooking pricey!
Good protein and Glutamine...throw creatine into the mix n ur good to go!

If you're given a joint the dots image of a flower do you get a teddy? BCAA's, which I do not use, DO have studies supporting their DOMs reductive qualities. L-Glutamine does not. The ONLY reason it'll help is because it's an amino acid and so a form of protein. As you're already supplementing protein you do not need to supplement L-Glut for DOMs reduction. Use it by all means but not for that purpose.

There really is no need, in this day and age, to try something 'just cos it's cheap' in the same way many could find the answers to questions they have via google and reading rather than just asking anyway. PubMed etc have 100's if not 1000's of studies and copies of published articles which just reading the conclusion of would help. That said some studies are piss weak so read a few.

I've said it before, supplementing with L-Glut seems to very dose dependant. Every argument I've seen here and elsewhere ends up 50/50. My opinion is that if your diet is high in whey protein (or similar) then you'll get a good dose. If you must use it then look up some good articles on Post Workout shakes and you'll see many add a little to maximise that time only. If I used it that'd be then. If I was looking for something to help with DOMs as a supplement it'd be BCAA (and yes whey is rich in all 3).

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Check this 2 part series examining Glutamine - yeah yeah I know it's T-nation but Dave Barr knows his stuff and is a renowned exercise physiologist...plus his own site is being revamped so can't link from there!

http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_supplements/glutamine_destroying_the_dogma_part_1&cr=

http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_supplements/glutamine_destroying_the_dogma_part_2&cr=

Currently rocking the Caveman Diet...

It's the t-nation thing. They will have reinvented the wheel and come up with a super version of it the week later LOL. But the second part says not to bother.

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My Grip book - click here and buy one