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carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 16:49:02
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Eric Marks
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I know here on MT, people don't recomend cab cutoffs often and I understand the reason- because it's not carbs at night that make you fat it's an excess of calories. But other forums and diets, such as DC (which is very popular and people swear by it) are very strict with carb cutoffs because they say that if you eat carbs before bed you "don't use them and you are inactive". If you eat carbs when you don't need them but eat a deficit of calories is it possible to gain fat but lose weight?
Similarly if your maintainence is 3000 calories and you ate 2500 calories of snickers and ice cream, would you gain fat but lose weight because of the lack of calories?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 16:56:34
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R3261
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it would be very difficult to lose weight and gain fat
eating just snickers + ice cream is a macro split not suitable for a body recomp
the rationale for carb cutoffs more likely to do with combatting overeating at night
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 16:57:24
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wallace9
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eric Marks
I know here on MT, people don't recomend cab cutoffs often and I understand the reason- because it's not carbs at night that make you fat it's an excess of calories. But other forums and diets, such as DC (which is very popular and people swear by it) are very strict with carb cutoffs because they say that if you eat carbs before bed you "don't use them and you are inactive". If you eat carbs when you don't need them but eat a deficit of calories is it possible to gain fat but lose weight?
Similarly if your maintainence is 3000 calories and you ate 2500 calories of snickers and ice cream, would you gain fat but lose weight because of the lack of calories?
Would you though??
I dont fancy trying it but surely if your eating 500cals below maintanance you wont get fat?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 20:42:40
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Eric Marks
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similarly if you ate your 1.5x body weight in protein and your efa's and then made up the rest of your calories with junk food and ice cream (lets say your bulking and so the rest of your calories means calories up to 500 more than maintenance) then would you gain the same amount of muscle as you would if you ate 1.5x body weight protein, efa's and the rest of the calories in clean fats and clean carbs
< Message edited by Eric Marks -- Apr. 15 2008 20:43:37 >
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 20:46:59
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Nigeepoo
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eric Marks
similarly if you ate your 1.5x body weight in protein and your efa's and then made up the rest of your calories with junk food and ice cream (lets say your bulking and so the rest of your calories means calories up to 500 more than maintenance) then would you gain the same amount of muscle as you would if you ate 1.5x body weight protein, efa's and the rest of the calories in clean fats and clean carbs Yes. You wouldn't get all the vitamins, minerals & fibre eating dirty, so health would suffer.
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 20:53:53
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hardgainer1234
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Nigeepoo
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eric Marks
similarly if you ate your 1.5x body weight in protein and your efa's and then made up the rest of your calories with junk food and ice cream (lets say your bulking and so the rest of your calories means calories up to 500 more than maintenance) then would you gain the same amount of muscle as you would if you ate 1.5x body weight protein, efa's and the rest of the calories in clean fats and clean carbs Yes. You wouldn't get all the vitamins, minerals & fibre eating dirty, so health would suffer.
I would have thought not. Because consuming kcals from coke compared to those found in meat can't be of the same value surely.. so how could you gain the same muscle mass with junk food and clean food? I would agree about body weight but muscle mass?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 20:57:04
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Eric Marks
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because you got the essential proteins and efa's needed i guess?
I believe that once you get the amount of protein and efa's needed that AFTER THAT a calorie is a calorie. Like 1 calorie from meat is the same as 1 calorie from cake
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 21:03:49
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hardgainer1234
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eric Marks
because you got the essential proteins and efa's needed i guess?
I believe that once you get the amount of protein and efa's needed that AFTER THAT a calorie is a calorie. Like 1 calorie from meat is the same as 1 calorie from cake
this sounds crazy to me tbh
It would mean that once I'm filled up with protein and EFA's I can drink coke and eat sweets etc and the calories will do the trick to pack on some nice lean muscle mass 
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 21:14:53
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Eric Marks
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lol i'm slightly confused too, that definitely doesn't sound right
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 21:22:27
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hardgainer1234
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eric Marks
lol i'm slightly confused too, that definitely doesn't sound right
I'm sure Nigepoo will give us a better explanation tomorrow 
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 15 2008 22:56:46
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Nigeepoo
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Both diets contain enough proteins & EFAs. Therefore both diets provide sufficient nutrients for muscle growth.
Where you get the rest of your energy from to fuel your training doesn't matter as long as there are enough carbs there.
I'm not recommending the eating of junk as it's deficient in things that keep you healthy. O.K.?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 1:11:26
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richsINS
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I think theres merit to 'carb cut offs', I personally ease off on carbs as it gets late as yes i am inactive and "right ammounts at the right times" is something i stick to.
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 16:06:53
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Eric Marks
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yea if you eat lots of carbs and are very inactive at night, that has to be a bad idea
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 16:24:07
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R3261
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quote:
yea if you eat lots of carbs and are very inactive at night, that has to be a bad idea
carbs are anticatabolic
keeping glycogen levels topped at all times is essential for optimal growth
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 16:37:56
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Chris M
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quote:
ORIGINAL: R3261
quote:
yea if you eat lots of carbs and are very inactive at night, that has to be a bad idea
carbs are anticatabolic
keeping glycogen levels topped at all times is essential for optimal growth
Of course this is the case. I can't believe this has not been mentioned before.
You can gain weight if your in calorie surplus. How much lean weight you gain as opposed to fat will be highly dependant on how stable your blood sugar levels are.
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 16:52:33
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R3261
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see the Timings thread by Integra
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 17:08:59
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Eric Marks
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is that correct? If you are in a surplus the ratio between lean muscle gain and fat will be higher if you eat slower carbs and keep blood glucose stable?
Also, if your glycogen stores are completely full, and you eat more carbs, dont these carbs then go to fat even if you aren't in a surplus?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 17:17:52
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R3261
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quote:
is that correct? If you are in a surplus the ratio between lean muscle gain and fat will be higher if you eat slower carbs and keep blood glucose stable? difference is negligeble for most
Also, if your glycogen stores are completely full, and you eat more carbs, dont these carbs then go to fat even if you aren't in a surpluscombined with keeping glyco stores topped up, daily bmr and increased carbohydrate oxidation with surplus carbs, carbs are rarely converted to fat. even so DNL (converting carbs to fat) expends a lot more energy than eating extra fat
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 17:24:48
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Eric Marks
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well I mean if your glycogen stores are full and you eat more carbs does it go to 'body' fat?
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RE: carb cutoff - Apr. 16 2008 17:36:02
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R3261
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a small part would be burnt off
the rest would be stored as fat
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