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storing hCG after defrosting - May 14 2008 15:03:02
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tigernut
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as said, long long after its been defrosted from the freezer will it keep in the fridge for??
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 14 2008 18:18:54
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tigernut
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i think we should vote for a ban on all things hCG!!! that way, rebellious bunch that you all are, we might all start talking proper about it!!  
...or in short BUMP
< Message edited by tigernut -- May 14 2008 18:19:20 >
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 14 2008 22:41:43
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BUFF STUFF
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I read somewhere freezing it is bad for HCG and makes it useless.
Dont quote me on that though.
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 14 2008 23:16:35
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tigernut
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it isnt a living culture so i doubt thats true. saying that, theres many a living culture you can freeze aswell, ball juice included, so unlikely to be a problem. i would ask you if you could dig out the place that you read that it would be useful, though i know that might not be possible. i read many a thing but cant remember where i erd it from 
edited cos i cant spell
< Message edited by tigernut -- May 15 2008 23:54:34 >
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 15 2008 23:58:04
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tigernut
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anyone else thoughts on freezing hCG? after doing some fishing on the manufacturers online hCG leaflets and webbies i cant find anywhere that recommmends freezing it, so BUFF may be on to something. sorry for practically dismissing your point from the off BUFF, ya might well be onto something. 
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 0:02:10
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pulitu
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iirc if hcg is still in powder form you can freeze it without damaging.
again iirc hgh is what's not supposed to be frozen.
not 100% sure tho
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 2:12:37
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tigernut
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quote:
ORIGINAL: pulitu
iirc if hcg is still in powder form you can freeze it without damaging.
again iirc hgh is what's not supposed to be frozen.
not 100% sure tho
in powder form it doesnt need freezing, it can just stay as it is.
the question is, once made up with BAC water, is it ok to freeze it?
the manufacturers i have noticed say that in actual fact it is ok to use in BAC water in the fridge made up for some 30days. assuming you can double that (not that i would want to risk more than 30 days really) thats a 60 day window. nearly enough time for 10000iu if your needing to use large amounts. i dont want that tho, i want small amounts 100-200iu EODish thoughout the cycle with gaps in between. 10000vials of hCG will last a long time at that dose and perIU its by far the cheapest way i can get it. there has to be a way to store it.
a trusted friend currently using this freezing once prepped method is content that it is ok to do this, but i'm just looking for further clarification on it with reports/articles backing it, pref medical documents. i trust him enough to proceed without this for now though, although there is a 'piece of mind' issue that i still need to put to bed, hence questions
ta for your input tho pulitu, as it could well be HgH that people are mistaken with. i know little about either as far as storing them go 
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 2:18:53
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viking34
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I have always kept my HCG at room temp away from sunlight and odd heat sources ie: heating vents/ O2 machines etc.
I spose you can freeze it , I just don't think it is required or necessary. I think you could keep it at room temp for years. Once reconstituted and put in the fridge maybe 4 months is all I would use it for but I have used it in the frige & reconstituted for 3 months quite regularly
Vik
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 5:47:01
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tigernut
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some interesting thoughts there viking. what are you doing, drawing it into another vial for storage or using the vial it comes in and jjust added BAC to that? i keep dried unopened hCG in the dark at room temp without even thinking about it, but once the BAC is added, i want to get it used aSAP so i freeze it to stop time so to speak so that once defroasted it is reay like when it was first mixed. little choice with 10000iu vials. i seriously dont fancy leaving it for more than 30 days which is the time given on the leaflet
http://www.ferringusa.com/fertility_products/insert_novarel.htm
anymore could be chancing it, but freezing it could be destroying it. i cant find anything that tells me i can do that other than the odd post on a BB site which isnt enough.
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:05:47
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dig
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dont have any proof, but m_l_c amongst others told me it was ok to freeze,
just not repeate freeze then thaws.
i froze mine and just thaw out 1 pin of 1000iu's at a time, when needed
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:12:07
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tigernut
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quote:
ORIGINAL: dig
dont have any proof, but m_l_c amongst others told me it was ok to freeze,
just not repeate freeze then thaws.
i froze mine and just thaw out 1 pin of 1000iu's at a time, when needed
cheers dig. you and him are pretty clued up folk so thats a bit more reassuring. suprised i cant find a paper/article/report on the practice though.
your doing what i am doing aswell by the sound on it. fill vial with bac andstir, draw into your main BAC water. draw into 1ml kits, freeze. defroat when ya want them
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:15:37
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dig
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tigernut
quote:
ORIGINAL: dig
dont have any proof, but m_l_c amongst others told me it was ok to freeze,
just not repeate freeze then thaws.
i froze mine and just thaw out 1 pin of 1000iu's at a time, when needed
cheers dig. you and him are pretty clued up folk so thats a bit more reassuring. suprised i cant find a paper/article/report on the practice though.
your doing what i am doing aswell by the sound on it. fill vial with bac andstir, draw into your main BAC water. draw into 1ml kits, freeze. defroat when ya want them
i do it slightly different but same result
my kits are 5000iu;s a vial
can be a bit of a pain lol
im 99.999% sure its ok to freeze then re-use and im sure m_c_l had proof to back it up mate.
just need to wait on him appearing
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:21:49
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tigernut
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gud gud cos it will settle my head then.
i was fine cos the idea came from a person that not only gave me the hCG, but who i trust on all stuff AAS anyway, then someone wrote in another post about it fooking it, then i fished about and couldnt find info on it da de da de da de daaaaa ya can see what i have done. ickle demon on me shoulder that wont go away at the mo lol my source is fine, the info will be fine, the lad does it himself for gods sake and he aint daft ...but one little doubter in a thread in a yanky board and then boooooooooooom! head up me ass
clearly i need to get out more! heh
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:43:59
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mad_cereal_lover
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I haven't got proof as such to back it up, however if you consider that when I work in the lab I use a lot of different antibodies and peptides, and HCG is a peptide. When you receive them from a manufactuer they are in larger amounts than you would use, eg. 100ul when you use 1-2ul at a time, etc. When you read instructions on reconstituting powder or storage of the pre-mixed peptide, it always says to aliquot it out - ie. dispense it out into smaller volumes (say 10ul) into different tube, and freeze that. It always says "avoid repeat freeze-thaw cycles."
NOw the reason for this is that peptides are often easily broken down and degraded - heat will degrade them and cold will preserve them more, generally (basic physics and chemistry on heat = more vibration of molecules and bond breakate etc). However repeatedly freezing and thawing then freezing again and later thawing is harmful to the peptide - going through those stages of solid -> liquid ->solid -> liquid requires energy that can cause the degradation of a small amount of the product each time. Thus it is advised to avoid REPEAT freeze thaw cycles. But this is after the company has sent you a FROZEN (on dry ice) large volume which you have to first thaw, then dispense into smaller volumes, then freeze, then thaw to use.
So with peptides, you may lose a small amount of the active peptide (1-2%) when you freeze-thaw it the first time, but that is really negligable so is generallyu considered fine to use. However if you say lose 1% activity every time (ie. 1% of the total peptide is degraded) you freeze-thaw, imagine how much you lose if you do 50 freeze-thaw cycles - which is why repeat freeze-thaw cycles are avoided.
As it happens, HCG is quite a stable peptide (many proteins I work with a company wouldn't even send you the protein in powder form at room temp but on dry ice!), so adding the two bits of info together is why I recommend for larger amounts having to be reconstituted that won't be used in say 3 weeks, can be individually frozen and thawed once for use.
mcl
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:46:23
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dig
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and as if by magic.........
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:51:26
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tigernut
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thankyou MCL a thorough explaination with got insider backing by the sound of it so thats as good as the report/paper/med article pretty much. what do you for a living then matey?
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 6:58:11
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mad_cereal_lover
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tigernut
thankyou MCL a thorough explaination with got insider backing by the sound of it so thats as good as the report/paper/med article pretty much. what do you for a living then matey?
I'm a cell biologist mate, work in research.
mcl
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 7:01:25
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tigernut
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mad_cereal_lover
quote:
ORIGINAL: tigernut
thankyou MCL a thorough explaination with got insider backing by the sound of it so thats as good as the report/paper/med article pretty much. what do you for a living then matey?
I'm a cell biologist mate, work in research.
mcl
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 10:52:56
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Northern Rocker
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not trying to hi-jack this thread as it's of interest to me.
But I keep seeing people saying they're mixing the BAC water from their HCG kit.
Now I understood that the water delivered in the kit was NOT bac water but rather a saline solution, which would keep for a few days in the fridge (not sure about freezing).
If longer cold storage was necessary then one would have to purchase BAC water separately and mix with that. Then it would keep for several weeks in cold storage.
So which is it ? A pregnyl 3 x 1500i.u. kit is delivered with BAC water or "solvent" which is what it says on the box ?
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RE: storing hCG after defrosting - May 16 2008 11:32:34
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mad_cereal_lover
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Northern Rocker
not trying to hi-jack this thread as it's of interest to me.
But I keep seeing people saying they're mixing the BAC water from their HCG kit.
Now I understood that the water delivered in the kit was NOT bac water but rather a saline solution, which would keep for a few days in the fridge (not sure about freezing).
If longer cold storage was necessary then one would have to purchase BAC water separately and mix with that. Then it would keep for several weeks in cold storage.
So which is it ? A pregnyl 3 x 1500i.u. kit is delivered with BAC water or "solvent" which is what it says on the box ?
"Bac water" simply means bacteriostatic water - ie. water sterilised and with a preservative to help inhibit growth of bacteria. Now this doesn't necessary mean benzyl alcohol - you can get a saline solution of say 0.56% NaCl which is considered bacteriostatic to a degree, or benzyl alcohol at 0.9% - both are sold as bacteriostatic.
mcl
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