training issue

 hello to u all .
 well i,ve been back in training for the past 4 months  at the moment i,m only doing it in my shed with free weights  but have had some good gains
but now i,m wondering if my routine is what it should be .the reason i,m saying this is i,ve been training 3 days a week and eating 5 small meals a day with two protein shake,s a day  and i,m not seeing the same as lads i know  . i know all our bodies are different and some gain a lot more and faster than others but i,ve not missed a day in the last 3 months and these lads just go the odd time . so i,ve got a routine i do with a training partner  i,ll let u have a look at it and if u can spare a bit off your time to point me in the right direction i would be very great full
 
mondays,-- CHEST@BACK
dumbbell bench press 5 sets of 5 / single dumbbell rows 5 sets of 5
decline bench  press 5 sets of 5/ upright rows              5 sets of 5
incline dumbbell press 5 sets of 5/ shrugs                      5 sets of 5
 
wednesday  ARMS
ez curls using arm blaster 5 sets off 6 /close bench  5 sets of 6
double dumbbell curls seated 4 sets of 6 /skull crushers /4 sets 6
single curls                            4 sets off 6  /dips 4 sets off 8
 
friday SHOULDERS@FORE ARMS
 shoulder press 5 sets off 6 /dumbbell shrugs 4 sets off 8
 lat raise            4 sets off 5 /front raise  4 sets of 6
 dumbbell shoulder press 4 sets off 6/
 fore arm curls 4 sets off 8
 
 i know some off u lot will look at this and laugh but this is why i,m asking for your help  .i,m not doing any cardio or leg work the now . the reason for this is that i,m a postie and walk about 8-10 mile,s a day with bags on my back so they get a load off work but i,ll be doing some as soon as i get my new bench . as i said i,m only using protien is there anything else u would recommend me to use to help me get through my work outs .
thanks for takeing your time and helping me out
 
 atb steven    
 
 
 

hmmm, I'd change quite a bit of that to be honest mate, I'd also try to add at least squats to your routine at some point too, but with what your doing now I'd tweak it to this myself..

chest,tri's

Flat db press 6x4
dips(weighted if poss)4x8
db flyes 4x8
skulls 4x6-8

back,bi's

Pull-ups(weighted if poss)4x6 (or deads 4x6)
db rows 4x6-8
EZ curls 4x6
single(concentration)curls 3x6-8

shoulders

shoulder press 4x6
lateral raises 4x6
upright rows 3x8
front raises 3x8

A little less volume but enough imo, change rep ranges if you want but those are a nice mix for certain exercises....should take 50mins -1hr max going heavy!!

I would change it quite a bit too.

Your still a beginner so what about a Push/Pull/Legs workout?

Obviously i understand you walk 8-10 miles a day but you could incorporate Legs into your workout too. 

Me personally, i'm a fan of 3 x 6-8 but would like to see some Deadlifts in there and as correctly said by strikalite some squats.

 Thanks for takeing the time to help me out lads it,s very much appriciated
. i,ve done the weights a good bit about 4 years ago but had the same problem as i am the now and then the kids came along and i just had to much to do  but now i,ve got the bug for it again .. the wieghts i,m doing r not in even close to u lads but there not light eather . db bench is sitting at 45kg,s dumbells and decline bench is 111kg,s
so i feel i,m doing heavy enough stuff to get some were , but looking at what u have said i might  be doing my stuff the wrong way around .thanks again lads
 

No worries mate,

Its not about what weight your doing, its all about your form and what your goals are.

There is another thread which discusses bad form and if your doing what you can do with good form and it works for you then thats all that matters.

No worries, keep us updated in what you decide to do as a new routine.

^^you're lifting some decent weight there mate make no mistake....but for example on Monday you're doing 30 sets and trying to 'cover' two major muscle groups and thus on 5x5 as well, far too much volume imo....sometimes it's hard to shorten your workout as your mindset is 'more is better' which is often a big mistake, imo you really don't need flat,incline and decline bench..

good luck mate..

Aks


No worries mate,

Its not about what weight your doing, its all about your form and what your goals are.

There is another thread which discusses bad form and if your doing what you can do with good form and it works for you then thats all that matters.

No worries, keep us updated in what you decide to do as a new routine.

 
  thanks again lads
  i know what u meen a few time,s i,ve tried to much and had to cheat to finnish a set so after that i,ve dropped to try and make sure i get the sets right
 
i,ll have to have a realy good think about what u lads have said to me ad try and come up with a new work out any hints or tips r great lads .
strikealite u r spoty on with your mind set  i often get to the end off a work out and think mm i should be doing more .if i,m thinking at the end off a set like this should i up sets of weights  or is this normal .

stevenb

r mind set i often get to the end off a work out and think mm i should be doing more .if i,m thinking at the end off a set like this should i up sets of weights  or is this normal .

You should be training as heavy as you can possibly go to complete the sets. The last set for my with my general 3 x 6-8 usually enables me to only get 6 out of it. I don't progress or up the weight until i can do 3 x 8 with good form.

At the end of a workout you should feel like you've worked hard. As said above, less is more sometimes in the bodybuilding world. You don't want to train so much that you begin to over train either. You may not feel as though you have worked your hardest but with the goals, right diet, workout and rest you will achieve your goals.

  it,s funny looking at what u lads have said to me i thought  u would have
picked the hell out off my arm work out as i thought that was m,y worst one .,  i feel sometime,s i need to up the reps and lower the weights on these. what do u think would u stick with 4/5x6 or would u go for  pyramid  sets .. arms is one thing that i find hard to work hard
once i get a new bench sorted i hope to have a squats rack set up aswel so i can sort out my legs aswel

SPOT ON STEVENB, YOU ARE NOW THINKING ABOUT VARIATION WHICH IS KEY TO ANY WORKOUT.
 
I THINK WHAT SOME MAY HAVE MISSED IS THAT YOU HAVE BEEN DOING THIS ROUTINE FOR 4 FREAKING MONTHS NOW. I ALWAYS ADVISE MY CLIENTS THAT IT IS BEST TO MIX THINGS UP A BIT, MAYBE NO TOO MUCH, EVERY 8 WEEKS OR SO.
 
AFTER 4 MONTHS YOUR BODY WILL BE ADAPTING SO MUCH TO YOUR DAY IN DAY OUT ROUTINE THAT I BET YOU BARELY EVEN WAKE UP SORE THE NEXT DAY ANYMORE.
 
AFTER DOING 4 MONTHS ON HEAVY WEIGHTS/LOW REPS I WOULD ADVISE THAT YOU DO GIVE YOUR OWN IDEA OF PYRAMIDING A GO.  ALSO, DROP THE WEIGHT DOWN A BIT AND FOCUS ON SOME QAULITY REPS.  MAYBE SOMETHING LIKE  15-12-10-12-15REPS  OR 12-10-8-10-12REPS  OR IF YOU STILL WANNA GO A HEAVY 8-6-4-6-8 REPS. I'D GET AWAY FROM LOW REPS FOR A MONTH OR 2 AND THEN GO BACK.
 
AS SOON AS YOU START LIFTING MORE REPS WITH A LIGHTER WEIGHT I GUARNTEE YOU THAT YOU'LL FEEL IT IN THE MORNING FOR THE FIRST WEEK OR SO AND FROM THIS YOU'LL KNOW ITS WORKING.
 
OR EVEN DO A HALF PYRAMID, LIKE THE ABOVE BUT ONLY 15REPS THEN 12REPS THEN 10REPS.
 
YOU SHOULD STILL AIM FOR FAILURE IN YOUR LAST SET IF NOT BEFORE.
 
AND *DIET*. YOU STILL NEED TO BE TAKING IN ENOUGH CALS TO BE ABLE TO GROW.  HECK YOU COULD EVEN MAKE A FEW EXTRA GAIN ON YA CURRENT WORKOUT BY JUST REVAMPING YA DIET.  I'D STILL RECOMMEND A CHANGE AROUND THOUGH AS YOU'VE BEEN DOING IT FOR 4 MONTH.
 
YOU'RE GAINS SHOULD START TO INCREASE IF YOU HAVE A CHANGE AROUND AND TRY AIMING FOR SOME HIGHER REPS. WORKED FOR ME BUT I KNOW WE AINT ALL THE SAME. BUT IT DOES SOUND LIKE YOU ARE IN THE SAME KIND OF RUT I WAS.
 
DONT GET ME WRONG, THERE'S SOME VERY SOUND ADVICE FROM THE GUYS ABOVE AND I RECOMMEND THAT  YOU TAKE THEIR IDEAS INTO ACCOUNT TOO AND EVENTUALLY YOU WILL FIND WHAT WORKS BEST FOR YOU. MAYBE IT'LL BE A LITTLE COMBO OF EACH, WHO KNOWS.
 
BUT THE HUMAN BODY ADAPTS REAL QUICK TO ANY GIVEN STIMULUS. MOST GUYS REMEMBER THIER FIRST PINT OF LAGER AND HOW DRUNK THEY WOULD GET OFF ONE OR TWO PINTS. BUT THE MORE THEY PUT IN THEIR BODIES THE MORE THEIR BODIES ADAPT TO IT AND THE MORE ALE IT TAKES FOR THEM TO GET DRUNK.  THIS KIND OF RESISTANCE TO BEER COME BE FAIRLY QUICK AND ITS NOT FAR OFF BEING THE SAME FOR THE MUSCLES TOO.
LIFTING WEIGHTS IN THE SAME OLD FASHION CAN MAKE THE GAINS SLOW DOWN.
 
THIS IS WHY VARIATION IS IMPORNTANT TO ANY ROUTINE.
VARIATION COMES IN MANY FORMS. THIS CAN BE AN EXTRA SET, EXTRA WEIGHT, EXTRA REPS, DIFFERENT LIFTING TEMPO AND LOTS OF OTHER THINGS.
 
DEFINATELY MAKE A CHANGE OF SOME SORTS AND HOPEFULLY THINGS WILL PICK UP FOR YA
 

     right lads now i,m takeing all this in and trying to work out a new routine
.bigbazza . i,ve problibly not told use enough off that i,ve been doing with my work out,s . i,ve changed my work out a few time,s in the last 4 months but as our  said my bodys get used to doing the same old stuff  but i,ve not done it enough i,m going to go down to a 12-10-8-6 pyramid sets for a few weeks and then i,ll have to work out  some thing new .  i have often changed the routine around is this a good idea . i normaly start with bd bench but ater a few months at than i change and start with delcine bd bench next time i change it would be to incline . is this a good or bad thing to do . as i said above would  any off u lads change my arm works out or should i just change it to pyramid sets for them .
diet wise i,m hopeless i just like to eat and i know this is a problem but when i,m in the mood i do eat good food not crap  . don,t get me wrong  there is days i,ll have the odd pudding  but were only human .

i'll be honest with you, changing my diet changed my gains....for the better. tho, again honestly, i find eating enough quality cals to be tough going but i'm certain i'll adapt. sometimes training aint the problem and its the lifestyle things that are.

in terms of training, in its simplest scientific form, all you have to do is get in the gym/shed,rip some muscle fibres and get the hell out of there and let your body repair the damaged muscles and make them bigger and stronger.

everyone knows the feeling that lets you know that you are going to be in pain in the morning and if nothin else that's what you should look out for.

i could go in the gym and do a pyramid or a dropset or even basic sets but the end result is the same...i just need to give my muscle groups enough stimulus to make them grow.

this could even be as simple as doing 3 all out sets e.g.

biceps - DB bicep curls

set 1 - as many reps as you can to failure with your chosen starting weight

set 2 - as many reps as you can to failure with the next weight up

set 3 - as many reps as you can to failure with the NEXT weight up

personally this wrecks when attempting high reps but can be just as tough with heavy weight/lower reps. when doing this with high weight/low reps you may want to do a full pyramid style where you then work your way back down to the weight you began with.

the above style is a little bit of shock treatment really but who knows, something as simple as that could get you a few extra gain without changing the diet but diet with very important.

after all you could just be lacking enough protein to warrant any extra building. meaning that you may only be consuming enough protein to maintain the muscle that you already have.

muscle proteins are in a state of constant synthesis, they are always being replaced. so the protein that you are ingesting daily is helping massively to replace existing muscle cells that you ALREADY have. once you are at this point its possible a time to add a little extra protein to your diet.
 
there's nothing all that bad about the arm workout as you've said, you're stalling. so mix it about in someway mentioned earlier.
 
all i can say about the chest,incline,decline and flats is that its better to do these than to not, even if it is a couple of months apart. but personally i get them all done on chest day or at the very worst add an exercise onto a different day

 . I know what u meen i,ve changed the diet a good bit since i,ve started back up eating more protien stuff and trying to get my 5/ small meals in aday
i take two protien shake,s a day  one in the morning and one at night thats
off training days and training days i take it as soon as i,m finnished training
. yesterday i done my chest and made a big mistake i put on too much onto the bar put it upto 112 and it was ment to be 105  but i managed to get  good 4 and second set i got 4 and the last two were 3 so i,m happy with that and i can feel it today .as i said u know when u have done enough and over the past month or so it ,s not been like that  so a shake up was due .
tomorrow is ment to be arms so i,m going to go for the pyramid sets and drop the weights a little so hopefully when i come on here tomorrow night they feel as if they have been worked . . upto now all i have done is read books and we all know some books say oe thing and other books say another . strikealite  pionted out a routine there were u would be doing  chest,tri's  on a monday
back,bi's  on a wed and shoulders on a fri . this is tottaly differant to what i have read and been told is this the one that could change it all for me  
 
 
 
 

it certainly could change it all for you and thats part of the beauty of this art so to speak but its also one of the biggest pains. there's nothing better than shaking up your routine and being happy with it, but there's nothing worse than not seeing the results that you wanted from it. its all trial and error why can obivously take time and results cant normally be seen until about 4-8weeks. 

another simple thing that i forgot to mention was that i usually plan a break away from working out usually after 9 or 12 weeks on i have a 1 week break. this helps the body and the central nervous system to recover and to give it a break from the stress.

so give what you think is best a go and let us all know how you get on and good luck

  thats also i,ve been thinking about is a week off . as i said before i,ve not missed a week in 4 odd months so i could do with a week off . i,ll have to start that every 9-12 weeks  one off the lads i work with is a javeling coach and he,s always on my back about doing my legs so i,ll have to get my new bench sorted and start to do them aswel  . what i,m going to do is write up another routine can u have a wee gander at it and see what u lads think off it  and let me know
 for a few weeks i,m goging to go back to the pyramid sets just for 3-4 weeks then i,ll go back to 5x5 for a month or so and so forth  
 

The reason people go for chest/tri and back/bi routine is because you're hitting two muscle groups at once quite intensely...the dips are great for hitting the chest and triceps for example, the db flat bench will also hit both groups too...you then wouldn't need a whole session for just the arms......it must be very hard trying to do chest and back together - 30 sets is far too much imo, know wonder you're looking forward to a week off lol(though as Bazza said, every 3 months or so then take a week off)...I just think that flat+incline+decline is overkill, dips for example would replace the decline anyway...

strikalite


The reason people go for chest/tri and back/bi routine is because you're hitting two muscle groups at once quite intensely...the dips are great for hitting the chest and triceps for example, the db flat bench will also hit both groups too...you then wouldn't need a whole session for just the arms......it must be very hard trying to do chest and back together - 30 sets is far too much imo, know wonder you're looking forward to a week off lol(though as Bazza said, every 3 months or so then take a week off)...I just think that flat+incline+decline is overkill, dips for example would replace the decline anyway...

Looking at it from the Chest/Bi, Shoulder/Tri, Back, Legs point of view (maybe if your more experienced) but on your chest day you hit the chest + tricep (from the compounds such as bench) then on the tricep day you hit your tricep + chest from compounds such as Dips.

I changed to that type of routine as i wanted and felt it would be more beneficial to target each muscle twice a week .

see, Aks is listening to his body, he feels that he needs to hit each body part twice a week.  i did the very same thing and still do every so often.  it's not always about following what everyone else does but more about fixing your routine to meet your requirement and preferrences. if you dont want to work a particular muscle group once a week then dont, if you think you'd benefit more from hitting it twice a week then do it.
 
also, Strikalite mentioned that flat,decline and inclice is overkill and to be fair he's right it is. but it fits in with my workout plan, i like the challenge, both my tri's and chest need improving currently so it is only a temporary system so dont take that as gospel.
 
just get back to what you know works, tweak it or change it when it doesnt, set yourself a weekly progression target and get massive :-)

 right lads i,m going to own up to another thing .lol
 i,ve been doing all my sets as super sets . bad i know daft aswel
but it keeps me going .sometime,s when i go in and i,m only doing
single stuff i have to much time to think and i don,t like that i,m going to have
to get my i-pod and get some good music on there to keep my mind on the sets
i,ve listend to both of u i,m takeing the rest off this week off well kind off
i done chest on monday and today was ment to be arms but i didn,t go out instead i done my garden path lol lifting  900 mm slabs back and forth lol
 
i,ve been thining about a new work out and i,m now lost lol but i,m going to change for definate
 i need to ask use one thing aswel lads what does this imo meen
 

In My Opinion.

if you have too much time to think then get a watch in there with you and time your rest periods. set a reasonable rest period and stick to it. my mind always used to go wondering and what i though was a 90 second rest would be more like 2 mins and a 2 min rest would be about 3mins.

point is, rest periods are also important so that you dont rest too long and lose your training effect.