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Alternative Vote - Yes or No?

Alternative Vote - Yes or No?

Yes   65% (23)
No   34% (12)

Total Votes: 35

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CheekyChappie
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2011/04/04 17:32:10 (permalink)
0

Alternative Vote - Yes or No?

First up, I know this is a thread on a political topic but I hope it is not considered 'political' in the sense that it needn't lead to arguments. I'm creating this thread to discuss the various arguments for and against the AV voting system as I am finding there are a lot of misunderstandings and alternative viewpoints concerning it.
 
I will say that, right now, I am considering voting 'Yes'. I think it is a system which will provide winners who are more agreeable to a larger number of people than with the current First Past the Post system. I also think a couple of the key arguments against it being put out by the 'No' campaigners are misleading or wrong.
 
1) Voters of extremist parties won't get their votes counted more than any other voter.
 
2.) If the person who only gets the 3rd highest number of 1st votes ends up winning, that isn't 'unfair', only if you are using the FPTP definintion of 'winning'. Someone who gets the 3rd highest number of 1st votes but who wins by getting a lot of 2nd or 3rd votes is arguably a more popular winner than someone who gets the most 1st votes (say 1/3) but who is despised by the other 2/3 of the population.
 

 
 
post edited by CheekyChappie - 2011/04/04 17:56:28
#1

54 Replies Related Threads

    Packup Pete
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 17:34:24 (permalink)
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    Political. Locked.
    #2
    Tony Barnes
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 17:36:06 (permalink)
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    lmao - why no poll??
     
    I'm for it - I thought the lib dems got scum ****ed last time round, voting system as it stands stinks
    #3
    CheekyChappie
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 17:38:34 (permalink)
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    lmao - why no poll??

     
    Duh, never even thought of it!
    #4
    Packup Pete
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 17:38:52 (permalink)
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    I am also for it, makes sense to me. 
    #5
    tac
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 17:51:48 (permalink)
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    Just to put in into perspective:
     
    There hasnt been a government since World War 2 that was actually voted for by more than 50% of the British public!
     
    Every single government we've had, in our lifetime, has come to power with more of the British public against them than for them. Even Thatcher's biggest landslide was only 48% of the vote.
     
    How can that possibly be right or fair in a 'democracy'?
     
    The voting system is LONG overdue for a change - we are the ONLY country in Europe that doesnt have either AV or PR (proportional representation). We're the only ones still operating a victorian era voting system.


    #6
    tkd67
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 18:03:18 (permalink)
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    Packup Pete

    I am also for it, makes sense to me. 

     
    Agree ^^^^^

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    #7
    sillynarbie
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 18:29:03 (permalink)
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    I'm voting yes. I didn't vote in the last election because my vote wasn't for the party which had a huge majority, making my vote pointless and essentially uncounted. At least this way the party I vote for will most likely have that vote recognised.
    #8
    Bookerman
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 18:52:16 (permalink)
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    A system put in place by the Lib Dems so the Lib Dems can form a coalition every election has to be a bad thing. Tough decisions need to be taken some time and the spineless Lib Dems will be a hindrance every time.

    "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -   George Orwell
    #9
    Spirit Guide
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 18:53:52 (permalink)
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    although its probably the right thing to vote yes, part of me wants to vote no because seeing the lib dems fail after having sold their souls would be shweeeeeeeeeet
    #10
    Puzzle
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 19:16:05 (permalink)
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    Although it has it's disadvantages, I think PR is the only fair voting system.  As for AV, I'll most likely vote for the change.
     
    It still means a government by electoral college rather than the popular vote but it's probably that little bit better than first past the post.
     
    Tac, I'm not sure that we're any more likely to get a government that the majority voted for, and if we're more likely to get coalitions then we're more likely to get governments that no one could have voted for. I think that's just the price of a fairer voting system.

    Massimo, MrMunch & Me.
     
    #11
    tac
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 19:22:13 (permalink)
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    Puzzle

    Tac, I'm not sure that we're any more likely to get a government that the majority voted for, and if we're more likely to get coalitions then we're more likely to get governments that no one could have voted for. I think that's just the price of a fairer voting system.

     
    True - but we're more likely to get a government that represents a fair compromise between what different people wish to see.
     
    We'll also avoid the ridiculous current situation where one party gets 40% of the vote and gets 350 seats, and another gets 20% of the vote and 10 seats - which is plainly ridiculous, as it means that in parliament the views of that 40% are 35 times as well represented as a group of people that is half as large.
     
    Although I agree with you, in that PR would probably be the best of the available systems - AV is a bit of a half-assed compromise, but better than no change at all


    #12
    CheekyChappie
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 19:25:29 (permalink)
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    Given that one of the Conservatives' main arguments for voting 'No' is that it will help out the BNP, it is ironic that the only other party supporting the 'No' vote is the BNP!
     
    AV will not help the BNP whatsoever, it will make it even harder for them to win any seats.
    #13
    tebow
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 19:45:10 (permalink)
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    I will vote no.
    I will then stand back and watch the coalition fall apart.(hopefully)
    #14
    tac
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 20:05:38 (permalink)
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    tebow

    I will vote no.
    I will then stand back and watch the coalition fall apart.(hopefully)

    coalition's likely to fall apart sooner or later whatever the result


    #15
    tebow
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 20:10:34 (permalink)
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    tac

    tebow

    I will vote no.
    I will then stand back and watch the coalition fall apart.(hopefully)

    coalition's likely to fall apart sooner or later whatever the result

    Yeh, this will only help that process though. I am genuinely excited about the level of votes the lib dems receive in the next election, can't wait to hear Clegg's excuses, if he even leads the party in the next one.
    #16
    Blasphemousfish
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 20:14:53 (permalink)
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    Even though it will make my election-night reporting shifts a couple of hours longer... I'm voting yes for AV.

    We do not forgive. We do not forget. 
    #17
    iaink
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 20:25:05 (permalink)
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    Yes.
     
    Lesser of 2 evils etc etc.
    #18
    daKensta
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 21:09:50 (permalink)
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    I vote yes, with my alternative vote being no.

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    #19
    Furious D
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    Re:Alternative Vote - Yes or No? 2011/04/04 21:52:05 (permalink)
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    I was going to vote "yes" until I was sent the most spineless piece of propaganda ever by the vote yes people.
     
    There was no explanation of anything, just a few quotes like:
    "AV will make your vote count"
    "AV will keep out the BNP"
    "Once in a generation chance for reform"
     
    Then the other 75% of the letter was filled with celebrities saying that they will vote yes.
     
    That was enough to persuade me that the "yes" camp do not have any good arguments for switching to AV, so it would be a bad idea to waste a "once in a generation chance" by switching to something equally as bad as what we have.
     
    I am still undecided, and as I will be away on polling day anyway, I will register a vote for the missing third category in this poll: abstention.
    #20
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