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Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point?

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lets.get.massive
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2011/03/13 10:09:54 (permalink)

Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point?

Hi all,
 
Since chatting to a pal of mine who is a nutritionist for the NHS, I've been giving it some thought about the very high protein intake as bodybuilders... i have also been bodybuilding for around 5 years and have had a high protein diet ever since, wheather it be cutting or bulking everything has always reveolved around high protein. 
Therefore i started asking myself a few questions which i thought maybe a few folk on here should be able to clear up?

 
*Can high protein diets be ran for life? 
 OR is there a cut off/cooling down period in which we need to give ourselves a break? 
*Are there any dangerous side effects from consuming a high protein diet for the rest of our bodybuilding lifes?
 
*How much protein is too much protein, i was told by a doctor recently that too much protein can cause kidney diseases?
(is this just Bull****?)
Just a few questions that i would like clearing up.
 
Like i said, I dont no the right or wrong answers on this one, im just curious to find out what you guys thought, as im sure alot of other bodybuilders have thought about the same thing? (dont shoot the messenger if u no what i mean lol)
 
 
 
 
 
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    opm_snape
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    Re:Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point? 2011/03/13 10:30:52 (permalink)
    I've often thought the same to be honest. I have also heard that it can give you kidney stones if you keep up the high protein diet but I think when you bulk and strip, your protein levels vary anyway from being extremely high in the bulk phase and relatively high in the strip phase. I wonder if that balances out somewhat?

    Anyway, as long as your body uses the protein (which it has to right?) then everything should be fine. Look at Arnie!
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    Pasty
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    Re:Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point? 2011/03/13 11:22:01 (permalink)
    Was it a Dietitian you spoke to? (There's very few nutritionists in the NHS...)

    The evidence is such that theres is no solid proof that a high protein intake (this is described as approximately 1.4 - 2.0 g of protein per kilogram of lean body mass) increases development of renal complications in trainees. Some research has shown a trend toward impaired renal function in pigs, how much you relate that to human kidneys is down to individual discretion (pig kidneys are remarkably similar to humans).

    If you have Diabetes (of any type) or renal impairment (nephrolithiasis, acute/chronic kidney disease etc)  then protein intake should be monitored closely, no argument here.

    My issue currently is such that unfortunately most trainees eat WAY above that aforementioned protein intake (e.g. by that mantra, a 75kg (lean body mass) athlete would need no more than 150g protein per day total) on a consistent basis.

    This is why I only advocate this intake and no more until more data is available.

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    kaldog
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    Re:Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point? 2011/03/13 14:21:15 (permalink)
    do you bodybuild/train rickmiller? (i could assume you do as you post here, but you never know!)

    if so what weight are you and roughly how much protein do you eat daily?

    Current goals: get back in the game
     
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    Gothic_Muscle
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    Re:Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point? 2011/03/13 16:18:44 (permalink)
    RickMiller

    Was it a Dietitian you spoke to? (There's very few nutritionists in the NHS...)

    The evidence is such that theres is no solid proof that a high protein intake (this is described as approximately 1.4 - 2.0 g of protein per kilogram of lean body mass) increases development of renal complications in trainees. Some research has shown a trend toward impaired renal function in pigs, how much you relate that to human kidneys is down to individual discretion (pig kidneys are remarkably similar to humans).

    If you have Diabetes (of any type) or renal impairment (nephrolithiasis, acute/chronic kidney disease etc)  then protein intake should be monitored closely, no argument here.

    My issue currently is such that unfortunately most trainees eat WAY above that aforementioned protein intake (e.g. by that mantra, a 75kg (lean body mass) athlete would need no more than 150g protein per day total) on a consistent basis.

    This is why I only advocate this intake and no more until more data is available.

    Would this be your recommendation if the person was hypocaloric, possibly runnning a large deficit or does your protein recommendation change within the context of a person's whole diet?


    Crohn's flare up free since '08 and meds free since '09 and counting...

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    Big Les
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    Re:Bodybuildings protein lifestyle, is there a cut off point? 2011/03/13 17:13:18 (permalink)
    Annsi Manninen did a review and found no link to high protein intake (almost any definition) and kidney damage in a healthy kidney.(this included stones which have a distinct pathology and risk profile(
    There were links (and that is a long way from cause) in diseased kidneys. And as Rick notes if you have conditions that predispose you - then you have to keep close tabs.

    However, the biggest problem encountered is the kidney function test used by the NHS, which uses a proxy marker to measure kidney function.
    This proxy assumes a protein intake of approx 50-90g a day maybe a bit more and a sedentary lifestyle and so is completely useless if you had a heavy workout in the last 48 hours (possibly even 72 if it was a heavy enough), use creatine, or have a protein intake over 150g per day.

    Many doctors incorrectly assume this is a problem, so before my annual health check I take a week off - I dont train, eat like a sedentary person - small portions, nice and healthy, and make sure all my supplements are clear too.

    Unlike Rick, I will go up to 3g per lb of lean mass or more - however, it is the athletes responsibility to monitor their heallth.

    as is I said least once a year I have a full blood panel, including BUN and Thyroid function done. And thats part of my annual health check on the NHS. For me this is a minimum, usually I get 6monthly checks done of my health, including my blood lipid profile, and have done for 15 years.

    You have to take responsibility, if you are pushing yourself hard, eating to support brutal training, then you are an idiot if you are not also checking your health regularly, especially if you are also availing yourself of all the supplements that are available to bodybuilders.

    Most bodybuilders I have met simply dont eat enough veg the truth be told!

    Finally, in my experience, unlike Rick, most clinical dietitians I have met have a massive knowledge gap when it comes to sports nutrition, and some are downright useless (having had an experienced dietitian who wanted to work in sport tell me a bodybuilder only needs 55g protein a day and whey is pointless with no application for example).


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