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Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results

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Cashman
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2004/01/07 15:25:37 (permalink)

Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results

As the post says I have just been to do the Origin Fitness tests outlined in the information below, to enable me to become MUCH more efficient in dropping my bodyfat levels.

Firstly here's the introduction to Origin Fitness' service
http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/article-originfit-system.asp

Basically it has given me a profile based on a series of tests that determines:

- Whether I am a fat or carb burner and relative percentages
- Your Resting Metabolic Rate - RMR - i.e cals used at complete rest
- My Daily metabolic rate (cals used based on average daily activity)
- Where my optimum heartrate should be for burning fat
- Where my heartrate is when it stops burning any fat and relies solely on muscle glycogen
- Where my VO2 max point was

These were very detailed indeed and kevin went through them in detail with me (thanks Kev).

So here's what I can remember so far (waiting for the full report to be posted in the next 24hrs and this may expand as I am sure I've forgotten a couple of points):

I'm a 75% Fat Burner (i.e 75% of calories my body uses are from fat, which means 25% are from carbs. Any excess carbs consumed compared to how much energy I burn I consume will turn to fat)

My RMR is 2250 calories (i.e. if I did nothing but sit in one place all day & night I need this many cals to maintain my present mass)

My Daily Metabolic rate is approx 3000 cals per day that I use in energy

My 100% fat burning effieciency heart rate is 105 bpm at which point I will burn approx 7 calories of bodyfat and only bodyfat every minute at that rate.

It was very interesting to note that my fat burn rate dropped right down to about 25% at 135 bpm IIRC, and then moved up to 95% efficient at around 148 bpm. Kevin asked me if this was where I did most of my base training for cardio and he was SPOT on to the beat!

I also found out where my VO2Max point was (need the report to confirm this point) but was quite impressed with my fitness considering I was not an elite athlete (yet! LOL) and had very recently stopped smoking.

Anyway it's definitelty worth travelling and paying for this service if you are serious about maximising your efforts in fat loss. You couldn't ask for a more helpful professional than Kevin - Origin @ MT - to lead you through it. So my advice is dig deep folks as it's well worth it for that kind of knowledge. What is gonna make it a real bargain is how I utilise this to my best advantage so watch this space......

I'll also be posting a starting BF% and weight reading (caliper reading) and tracking it weekly to guage progress.

Origin and James please feel free to chime in at any point and correct me on anything I might have misunderstood. And everyone feel free to get involved in this thread.

Updated current stats:

Weight - 233Ib
Bodyfat % - 18%
Current Lean Mass - 191Ibs
Current Fat Mass - 42Ibs

#1

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    gymbabeliz
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 15:43:13 (permalink)
    That sounds really useful. So for you personally, to burn fat most effectively, you only need to do walking or something!?

    Where is Origin/ kev based? It would be useful to know what intensity of cardio works best for me, before I start to cut.
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    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 15:48:30 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by gymbabeliz

    That sounds really useful. So for you personally, to burn fat most effectively, you only need to do walking or something!?

    Where is Origin/ kev based? It would be useful to know what intensity of cardio works best for me, before I start to cut.



    Funnily enough I was thinking this would be ideal for you Liz. He's in Hornchurch in Essex so it's only just over 30 mins away for you.

    Yep for 100% fat burning efficiency mid paced walking is fine LOL. I think I'll work at the 95% efficiency range though and build a good sweat (148 bpm).
    #3
    gymbabeliz
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 15:53:22 (permalink)
    30 minutes to Essex! I dont drive the way you do Cash!!!!

    But still worth thinking about.

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    smiddy
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 15:55:02 (permalink)
    i think they are based in essex, i might take a trip down when i have mid term break at college, it's sounds fantastic! if you think about the price £100 for both tests(is that the right price??) anyway whaen you find your exact requirement you will save so much money on supplements and food! knowing what you need will cut out ALL the guess work!
    #5
    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 16:01:31 (permalink)
    Smiddy, it's only £75 for muscletalk members so it's a definite bargain IMHO as you rightly say it takes the guess work out of what you do and helps you plan VERY efficiently what you need to do. I'll let you know when I've got a full plan of action together over the next few days.

    LOL liz. :-)
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    petehert
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 21:20:08 (permalink)
    148bpm...i'll second that.
    At least you 'feel' like your doing something constructive.
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    FrOgR
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/07 21:50:27 (permalink)
    Very informative, i've often wondered why people say the best fat burn is at 60% of MHR when you see guys next to you on a treadmill going 200 miles an hour. i've been hitting 150bpm because my body just feels right at that and i just wouldn't feel right going for a saunter on a treadmill :D
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    James
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 11:23:16 (permalink)
    Liz - I too was going to suggest this for you when we next spoke. I know you struggle with those last few bits and have reached a bit of a plateau. This will help you no-end and is well worth the money for someone as motivated as you.

    Cash - I will look at this journal with interest.
    #9
    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 11:37:04 (permalink)
    No worries James.

    Invested in heart monitor today as well. Hopefully it's £50 well spent :-)

    I've got training this evening (legs day) and I know that cardio beforehand is to be avoided so as to not deplete muscle glycogen before the weight training. Now here's where it get's interesting as theoretically if I do 30 mins moderate treadmill walking beforehand at 105 bpm heart rate I am at 100% fat burning effieciency which means that my body should NOT TOUCH a single calorie from muscle glycogen allowing me to do a nice 30 min warm-up and still have all the strength I need to go hard on legs.

    Now, if legs takes me an hour then I'd hazard a guess that my heart rate will remain around the 105 mark for the majority of my training hour apart from raising when I'm performing the lift itself and then dropping to around 105 in the rest periods (between sets & exercises). I'll be wearing the monitor throughout so I'll be able to tell you exactly what happens, but if this theory works out then I could have an average workout of 1hr 100% efficienct fat burning (from a total of 1.5hr total training) before I even think about doing anything that would involve my definition of cardio (at 150bpm where I am still 95% efficient!) :-)). If this works out like this then I should have burnt well over 400 calories from my bodyfat just by having a stroll and doing a normal weight training session.

    Sounds strange yet based on the figures makes sense to me so far unless I have misunderstood anything.
    #10
    origin
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 12:50:45 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by petehert

    148bpm...i'll second that.
    At least you 'feel' like your doing something constructive.


    Dont forget cashmans best fat bump was 105 bpm,100% efficient.
    Take into account his true max 176 bpm (not 191 bpm).
    It takes all guess work away from 220 minus your age multiply by 60% etc.
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    petehert
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 13:15:30 (permalink)
    quote:
    Dont forget cashmans best fat bump was 105 bpm,100% efficient.
    Take into account his true max 176 bpm (not 191 bpm).
    It takes all guess work away from 220 minus your age multiply by 60% etc


    Total understand where you're coming from with the 105bpm for maximum fat burn.
    As you have said before, its up to the individual what they do with the results and info they are given. Next time I see him on the bike I shall check he is running at 105bpm.
    Is the 60% of MHR rule true then for max fat burn as long as you know your 'TRUE' max?? Or are cashmans results just coincidence?? (60% of 176=105)
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    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 13:24:05 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by petehert

    quote:
    Dont forget cashmans best fat bump was 105 bpm,100% efficient.
    Take into account his true max 176 bpm (not 191 bpm).
    It takes all guess work away from 220 minus your age multiply by 60% etc


    Total understand where you're coming from with the 105bpm for maximum fat burn.
    As you have said before, its up to the individual what they do with the results and info they are given. Next time I see him on the bike I shall check he is running at 105bpm.
    Is the 60% of MHR rule true then for max fat burn as long as you know your 'TRUE' max?? Or are cashmans results just coincidence?? (60% of 176=105)



    LOL. I'd not looked at it that way. What's interesting especially is that where I do my base training at 148bpm I'm 95% efficient which is probably where I'll be doing my cardio specific sessions (swimming, bike, etc). One thing I'd like to point out is that I should work my way up to what zone I want to train in or I run the risk of "falling off the shelf" and steaming straight into a high carb/glycogen burning state which then becomes very hard for the body to switch out of for the remainder of the training session.
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    origin
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 15:08:47 (permalink)
    Just pure coincidence,
    Cashman,you are very efficient ta 148 bpm but not 98% you still burnt nearly as much fat but more carbs?

    105 bpm = 7.6 k cal direct from fat 100% efficient

    149 bpm = 5.8 kcal out of a total 16.3 kcal 35% efficient
    Diff is 1.8 fat k cal per minute (not a lot of diff)
    So over an hour the diffrence between the two zones is 108 fat k cal.
    Remember between 105 to 148 your efficiency drops to 19% and then shoots back up then drops of to o% at 167bpm.
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    gymbabeliz
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 15:48:09 (permalink)
    Origin - so this is going against the idea of HIIT for fat loss/muscle sparing, isnt it.
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    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 16:00:12 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by origin

    Just pure coincidence,
    Cashman,you are very efficient ta 148 bpm but not 98% you still burnt nearly as much fat but more carbs?

    105 bpm = 7.6 k cal direct from fat 100% efficient

    149 bpm = 5.8 kcal out of a total 16.3 kcal 35% efficient
    Diff is 1.8 fat k cal per minute (not a lot of diff)
    So over an hour the diffrence between the two zones is 108 fat k cal.
    Remember between 105 to 148 your efficiency drops to 19% and then shoots back up then drops of to o% at 167bpm.



    Thanks Origin, my mistake. I'll make sure it's all bang on for my cardio fat/burn zones when the report comes in the post then. Until then I'm sticking with 105 to be safe for the next couple of days.
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    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 16:02:45 (permalink)
    GBL makes a very good point Origin. I know you've done a number of tests with the equipment involving different fat burners, etc but have you tested to see the effect of HIIT cardio relating to fat burning efficiency versus glycogen/carb burning, fat cals, etc, etc? If not then perhaps well worth testing out.
    #17
    Cat-kicker
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 16:08:51 (permalink)
    Cashman - So it's £75 for BOTH tests for MT members?
    If so, that sounds excellent. I remember reading Scott Sykes (scooter?) original report on this, but he seems to have stopped posting so I don't now how he has got on in the longer term. It will be really interesting following this.
    #18
    Cashman
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 16:18:11 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by Cat-kicker

    Cashman - So it's £75 for BOTH tests for MT members?
    If so, that sounds excellent. I remember reading Scott Sykes (scooter?) original report on this, but he seems to have stopped posting so I don't now how he has got on in the longer term. It will be really interesting following this.



    Yep - £75 for both tests. If you've got it spare then it's worth it IMHO. It takes the guesswork out of how your body metabolises fat during exercise and at what rates, and that's useful info for anyone that wants to cut. Mail Origin if you are interested, he's a very helpful bloke.
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    smiddy
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    RE: Cashman's Origin Fat Loss Journal -Revised Results 2004/01/08 19:17:20 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by Cashman

    Smiddy, it's only £75 for muscletalk members so it's a definite bargain IMHO as you rightly say it takes the guess work out of what you do and helps you plan VERY efficiently what you need to do. I'll let you know when I've got a full plan of action together over the next few days.

    LOL liz. :-)



    that is even better! i am going to try and see if i have the time and money(iam a student...we are always broke!) to go down for the day during when we have a holiday.
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