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Drop bent over rows or not??

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Roger Mellie
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2003/11/24 02:24:33 (permalink)

Drop bent over rows or not??

This is my back day:

Deadlifts
Bent over barbell rows
Pulldowns
Barbell Curls
Reverse Curls
Forearm Work

The bent over rows are really bad. It feels like it doesn't hit the back too well anyway but especially after doing deads. Having to bend over again kills my lower back. Do you think I should drop them or what's the alternative??

Also, I've read on here that I should get upto my own bodyweight on pulldowns before switching to chins which I have heard are a better exercise. The only thing is I reckon it will be months before I get to my own bodyweight on pulldowns. Am I better off to change now or later??
#1

16 Replies Related Threads

    Dano
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 04:01:08 (permalink)
    NOW
    #2
    Frankie NY
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 04:36:38 (permalink)
    Franco:

    Barbell rows are one of those exercises that you don't "feel" as much but are extremely effective at adding mass. Very few people actually feel them. I would definitely keep them. If they bother your lower back, then your form is not spot on, even if you just deadlifted.

    In my experience, pulldowns don't necessarily build chinning strength. I've seen many guys add 20 or 40 pounds over their bodyweight in pulldowns but not make any gains in number of chins. Likewise, I've seen many guys that cannot do pulldowns with their bodyweight, but can do 15-20 chins.

    The best way to build your chinning strength is to do chins. AND chins will build a much more impressive back than pulldowns. For most guys pulldowns are a complete waste of time and add no muscle mass or chinning strength.
    #3
    shreklikedave
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 13:45:19 (permalink)
    You could do your rows first then deads.

    To feel the rows simply retract your shoulder blades and keep them like that as much as possible throughout the whole movement.

    If you want to drop anything drop pulldowns. I'll give you sympathy about the chins though i hate them!
    #4
    Roger Mellie
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 15:16:49 (permalink)
    Thanks guys, great replies. I'll try barbell rows first and switch to chins.
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    GoldenArrow
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 20:06:48 (permalink)
    You might also have a problem with your back, might be worth getting it checked.
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    PauliE
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/24 23:26:50 (permalink)
    I can't do barbell rows for the same reason, it kills my back.

    Also being so tall and leaning over is a bitch because when I do it my heels come off the floor.

    I've been doing d/b rows and I've added much more weight on doing it, more size also.

    For people like us that's the best option, not chins.
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    Genon
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/25 04:44:48 (permalink)
    Maybe a lil off topic but your routine seems like alot...

    Deadlifts
    Bent over barbell rows
    Pulldowns
    Barbell Curls
    Reverse Curls
    Forearm Work

    How many sets do you do for each of these? Even if you did 3 you would be overtraining your biceps, and maybe even your forearms.. Drop forearm work and reverse curls and ya change pulldowns to chins.
    #8
    shreklikedave
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/25 09:38:56 (permalink)
    'Also being so tall and leaning over is a bitch because when I do it my heels come off the floor.'

    Bend your knees and push your glutes backwards then adopt and angle of about 45 degrees with your hips. If you are still overbalanced then push your glutes back futher with more weight through your heels.
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    PauliE
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/25 16:59:13 (permalink)
    Tried that Dave, I get bad lower back pain after still.
    #10
    shreklikedave
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/26 13:46:40 (permalink)
    Fair enough, my mate has alot of problems doing these and he's tall as well.

    Have you ever tried t bar rows (chest on a pad) or setting a bench to an incline then lying on your front and performing a row but with a db in each hand.

    Nothing wrong with db rows of course, just a few suggestions
    #11
    GTM
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/26 15:45:01 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by shreklikedave


    Nothing wrong with db rows of course...



    There certainly isn't !!

    It's all well and good doing exersizes to increase core strength.. but if every exersize is done just to make it have core strength...then all you're going to end up doing is weakening your core by overtraining it.. muscles are muscles and if you do too many exersizes that hit the same muscles you're not going to be able to progress in any exersize because your core will become strained and will hold you back.

    Yes.. Deadlifts are a great mass building exersize...
    Yes.. barbell rows are a great back/mass building exersize
    Yes ... squats are another great mass building exersize..

    BUT do them ALL (especially on the same day or consequtive days)... and you'll just end up defeating the purpose of doing core strength building exersizes.

    IMHO.. if you're doing squats and DLs.. you don't need any other core strengthening exersizes.. you can do supported DB rows, so that you can actually work your back.. or you can do seated military presses to allow you to use more weight.

    Core strength is important.. but trying to work it with every exersize you do is IMHO.. not required... in fact I'd say it's most likely to be counter productive.

    GTM
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    shreklikedave
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/27 08:34:32 (permalink)
    I've noticed that, i dont do deads any more because of the overlap with squats, not discounting them completely but when i go back to doing them i'll probably go onto presses instead of squats for legs.

    I just like barbell rows nut then i've got a good build for doing them. (short!! lol)
    #13
    Roger Mellie
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/28 17:11:38 (permalink)
    Well, that was one of my first questions when I started my routine. I do Stiff Legged and normal deads. Maybe it would be an option for me to drop normal deads altogether??

    Do people here feel that the normal deadlift works the back more than the stiff legged?? I'm sure I feel it further up my lower back with normal deadlifts?

    I do squats as well so maybe my legs don't need the extra bashing that deads give them.
    #14
    GTM
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/11/30 12:41:28 (permalink)
    Franco...

    I think DLs are a good exersize.. but they really do need to be taxing IMHO..(which is all relative of course - my dead is weak compared to a lot of others here).. I think it's fairly pointless doing them with a weight that you can manage 3 sets of 10 reps with..except for when you're doing them for the first time.. as then your lower back will be the most stressed part during DLs. Once your lower back does start to strengthen.. you can start progressively using heavier weights and lower reps.. and you shouldn't realy feel any particular stress in your lower back if your doing them properly. At least that's how it feels to me. Like anything else.. whether you do them on the same day as squats really depends on how taxing you find the two exersizes. I have encorporated deads in to my workout .. but I'm not aiming to specialise in them as a strength exersize.. It's just another tool I use along with any other exersize I find useful, so I am more than happy to do them on the same day as other exersizes. To me it's the combination and variety of exersizes that lead to an overall growth of a decent balanced physique.. not putting all your efforts in to one or two exersizes, no matter how good they are.

    GTM
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    Roger Mellie
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/12/01 00:39:03 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by GTM

    Franco...

    I think DLs are a good exersize.. but they really do need to be taxing IMHO..(which is all relative of course - my dead is weak compared to a lot of others here).. I think it's fairly pointless doing them with a weight that you can manage 3 sets of 10 reps with..except for when you're doing them for the first time.. as then your lower back will be the most stressed part during DLs. Once your lower back does start to strengthen.. you can start progressively using heavier weights and lower reps.. and you shouldn't realy feel any particular stress in your lower back if your doing them properly. At least that's how it feels to me. Like anything else.. whether you do them on the same day as squats really depends on how taxing you find the two exersizes. I have encorporated deads in to my workout .. but I'm not aiming to specialise in them as a strength exersize.. It's just another tool I use along with any other exersize I find useful, so I am more than happy to do them on the same day as other exersizes. To me it's the combination and variety of exersizes that lead to an overall growth of a decent balanced physique.. not putting all your efforts in to one or two exersizes, no matter how good they are.

    GTM



    How did you know I was doing 3 sets of 10, I've searched my posts and I don't remember telling you that. [:0]

    Anyway, I'm going down to 3 sets of 8 as I'm getting heavier. I do squats and stiff legged deads on the same day and it kills me doing them after squats. Anyway, if anyone knows, do deadlifts work more muscles in the back than stiff legged deadlifts??

    I'm gonna try deads over the next couple of weeks just to make sure it's not my form. If it is my lank legs then I'll have to drop them. [V]
    #16
    shreklikedave
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    RE: Drop bent over rows or not?? 2003/12/01 11:40:52 (permalink)
    From personal experience i would say yes but it depends on the technique of your sldl.


    You will feel stiff legs deads mainly in your hams and lower back whilst deads you will feel all the way up to your traps
    #17
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