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I'm going Vegan...

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Drew Price
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2009/07/28 18:07:52 (permalink)
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I'm going Vegan...

..almost.

I love meat but I am trying Flexitariansim for the next month - maybe (much) longer. Basically I'll be vegan except for 2, maybe 3 flesh containing meals a week. It is a trade off between the moral and environmental reasons for veganism and the health benefits of eating meat. I have bloged it here with details of menu change:

http://drewprice.co.uk/blog/?p=166

I see the main issues as this

1) The carb issue: My body doesn't do well on high carbohydrate diets. When you only eat plant products it's hard to avoid reasonable amounts of carbohydrate.
2) The protein issue: getting enough high quality, concentrated sources of protein, protein without a lot of carbohydrate or fat.
3) Protein as above without relying on a narrow selection of foods and supplements
4) Compliance: taste and mouth feel. I like meat!

Now, being a nutritionist I have helped athletes around these issues before but still, it will be interesting. I'll probably fire up the journal again to give some idea as to daily diet and training.

I welcome advice from veggies and vegans?!! Any ideas?

And from meat eaters...thoughts? Comments? Please post no pictures of steak!

post edited by drewsky - 2009/07/28 18:14:03
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27 Replies Related Threads

    hamiltonsfitness
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 18:35:22 (permalink)
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    health benefits of eating meat.


    You wouldn't believe the number of studies that will tell you that it's healthier not to eat meat.
    #2
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 18:46:18 (permalink)
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    ...or the number confounds associated with their findings!
    post edited by drewsky - 2009/07/28 18:47:44
    #3
    Boss Redd
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 19:10:06 (permalink)
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    Say good bye to bacon double cheese bugers

    I do a lot of push ups and sit ups. And I drink plenty of milk.

    #4
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 19:32:54 (permalink)
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    We kind of went out separate ways a while ago mate.

    I don;t want to get into a big discussion about it but to expand on the whole Meat Healthy/Meat Bad issue. I'll lay my views on the table:

    I am a believer that meat has it's part in a healthy diet. You just have to choose the right types and the right amounts and get the rest of the diet right. I feel that

    1) Most (all?) population studies linking meat with disease have a great number of confound issues such as quality, other components of diet, lifestyle etc.
    2) There are clearly accessory nutrients associated with the protein in meat and fish that can be beneficial - of course there are usually other sources of these.
    3) Clear problems are associated with over processed meat AND vegetable matter.

    Quantity, quality and the WHOLE diet is what it boils down to.



    #5
    HicSuntDracones
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 20:26:55 (permalink)
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    Are your going Vegetarian or Vegan? (Bar the odd piece of meat..... :S ) This determine whether eggs and dairy can be a source of protein.....
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    HicSuntDracones
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 20:38:31 (permalink)
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    Just seen your progress journal where you say your cutting dairy and eggs so vegan then.....

    Are you going to be using soya products (mince etc.), Tofu, Quorn? I tend to eat a lot of this (but as an ovo-lacto veggie) I eat dairy and eggs too which helps with the protein. Else you're going to be going down the nuts, beans route which I think you'll struggle to get enough protein with (well and the bodybuilding bit).


    #7
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 21:10:40 (permalink)
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    Yep, no eggs or dairy.

    I will be using soy but I don't like a lot of the products commonly available. Also I like to spread my choices so I'll be using pea protein, tofu/soy, rice protein.


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    hamiltonsfitness
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 21:21:12 (permalink)
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    The Oxford Vegetarian Study is a good one:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10479226

    studying 6000 vegetarians and 5000 non vegetarians over a twelve year period and adjusting for smoking, body mass index, and social class and still found that death rates were lower in non meat eaters than in meat eaters for all causes of death.
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    theiopener
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 21:26:22 (permalink)
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    1) The carb issue: My body doesn't do well on high carbohydrate diets. When you only eat plant products it's hard to avoid reasonable amounts of carbohydrate.
    2) The protein issue: getting enough high quality, concentrated sources of protein, protein without a lot of carbohydrate or fat.
    3) Protein as above without relying on a narrow selection of foods and supplements
    4) Compliance: taste and mouth feel. I like meat!


    TVP / Quorn / tofu / tempeh and possibly seitan (homemade from wheat gluten flour which is 80% dry weight protein, 4g of carbs and no fat per 100g) are going to be your food choices that fit the above here.

    Seitan if made properly in an oven has a very meaty texture and there even exists a few recipes for faux fillet steak made from it which i have tried and its pretty good.

    Seitan is highly versatile, even a bad batch can be made into minced beef style in a food processor.

    Im lacto ovo but thats because i cant stop my love affair with cheese!
    #10
    just t
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 21:36:17 (permalink)
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    hamiltonsfitness

    The Oxford Vegetarian Study is a good one:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10479226

    studying 6000 vegetarians and 5000 non vegetarians over a twelve year period and adjusting for smoking, body mass index, and social class and still found that death rates were lower in non meat eaters than in meat eaters for all causes of death.


    LOL,

    you slam other studies for flaws then fail to see the flaws in your own studies?


    #11
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 22:20:26 (permalink)
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    hamiltonsfitness
    The Oxford Vegetarian Study is a good one:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10479226
    studying 6000 vegetarians and 5000 non vegetarians over a twelve year period and adjusting for smoking, body mass index, and social class and still found that death rates were lower in non meat eaters than in meat eaters for all causes of death.

    Good? I would say great, but they still don't control for many issues. It would be interesting to see how these corrolates compare with correlations for specific phytonutrients and also GI and II.  I espouse diets high in phytonutrients and fibre but I still include meat: i.e. eat meat but eat a LOT of a variety of fibrous veg.

    With most meat eaters diets you can

    Lower sat fat intake
    Decrease insulin 'load'
    Increase fibre (all types)
    Increase accessory nutrient intake
    Increase phytonutrient intake

    ..and only the first needs you to do anything to the meat. Simply:

    1) eat higher quality foods,
    2) eat more veg - usually at the expense of over processed grains


    post edited by drewsky - 2009/07/28 22:29:15
    #12
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 22:24:40 (permalink)
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    theiopener
    TVP / Quorn / tofu / tempeh and possibly seitan are going to be your food choices that fit the above here.

    Cheers TIO , I have all the above good to go. Setian I am especially looking forward to cooking with,  however 3 out of the 5 above are soy based so variety is still an issue.

    I have used pea isolate in cooking before but, well the faux meatloaf even with only a little in and lots of spices tasted like a large wasabi coated pea. Not nice.


    #13
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 22:42:52 (permalink)
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    Cheers Manuka,

    Yes I hear you, the calcium issue may be off set by the other facets of the diet like acid/base balance (which before I get shouted down does have an effect upon both Ca/PO4 metabolism and PTH in bone) but you can still mess this up on vegy/vegan diet. But really it's nigh on impossible to know. I am assuming age and training will mean that this should remain uneffected. Also it's only a few weeks.

    The B12, well nutritional yeast, which I will be sprinkling liberally on things, sees that sorted.
    post edited by drewsky - 2009/07/28 23:02:09
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    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/28 23:08:33 (permalink)
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    Yes also a problem for some quick tip I'm sure you know but... non heam iron; eat it with vit c to increase absorption. Not a problem for me though given what I plan to eat. 
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    kitty
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/29 07:43:53 (permalink)
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    I think doing something like this as a Nutritionist is fabulous. It gives a more clear insight to how diets can affect you both physically and mentally. I'm sure it will only make you a better consultant
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    theiopener
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/29 07:59:49 (permalink)
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    drewsky
    The B12, well nutritional yeast, which I will be sprinkling liberally on things, sees that sorted.

    If this is the Marigold stuff then as far as i am aware its devoid of b12. I take a sublingual b-12 every day as they are very cheap from **** for a years supply.

    If you need help with seitan or suppliers for the flour let me know. I also have a few recipes you may want to try out if youre a dab hand in the kitchen.
    #17
    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/29 09:20:41 (permalink)
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    I have the fortified stuff. B12 breaks down quite easily so keep i in the cupboard.

    Cheers for the offer. I have a shed load of gluten and quite a few recipes from vegan blogs, but I am always on the look out for meatloaf ideas!
    post edited by drewsky - 2009/07/29 09:21:42
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    theiopener
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/29 11:21:34 (permalink)
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    What i find works well for meatloaf (it comes out somewhat soft with a good crust) is to use the following

    300g cauliflower mashed
    100g tvp
    100g gluten flour
    100g tomato puree
    herbs and spices

    Combine this all into a food processor and blend and simple scoop out into a greased tin and baked at 200C for at least an hour, maybe more till a good crust forms on it.

    Once cooled it slices very well and goes in sandwiches great i find.

    BTW low carb tortillas work well by combining equal parts of gluten flour to ground flax powder with a little water and toasted in a dry frying pan.

    Or using the above tortilla recipe, add in some parmesan cheese, roll out flat and bake in an oven till its dried and you get some awesome parmesan flax high protein tortilla chips. You may want to cut it to shape or crack it as the sheet youll get from it can be large.
    post edited by theiopener - 2009/07/29 11:23:06
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    Drew Price
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    Re:I'm going Vegan... 2009/07/29 14:45:51 (permalink)
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    Ehhh, had not thought about using cauli... is this a type of bolgne type smooth meatloaf? I generally tend to make a rougher one with peppers etc. Cheers for the tip on the tortilla. Will give that a go - sadly without the cheese.
    #20
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