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omnigate
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2005/08/03 02:27:01 (permalink)
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Lance Armstrong

I heard many people feel Lance was doping. In reading about test, I've only seen it in the context of strength and mass. If Lance was doping, what would an endurance athelete's cycle/stack look like?
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    Medichecks
    PaulSF
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 02:47:34 (permalink)
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    The mans been tested and tested, he simply does not dope! As chisco was saying the mans a genetic freak, to have achieved what he did after beating cancer is simply incredible.
    #2
    APB
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 02:59:27 (permalink)
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    Your very naive if you think he's clean. To give you an idea of what he is on, here's what was found in one of the cars belonging to the Festina team at the 1998 Tour de France:

    "234 doses of erythropoietin (EPO), 80 flasks of human growth hormone, 160 capsules of testosterone, 60 pills of a blood-thinning agent, and a three-week supply for nine riders of "Belgium Mix," a stay-up-all-night cocktail of cocaine, heroin, caffeine and corticosteroids"
    http://www.sportingnews.com/experts/dave-kindred/20040712.html

    7 years out of date, but they will still be on the same kind of drugs.
    #3
    APB
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 03:17:55 (permalink)
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    ORIGINAL: chrisco954
    so you are one of those guys..........the guys who reads the tabloid that says "baby born with wooden leg" or possibly "Noah's Ark found on Moon......And you COMPLETELY believe it........................I really do feel sorry for you man


    So you are one of those guys........who reads Lance's autobiography, hears him speak on TV and reads articles and interviews about him.......and believe him when he says he's clean..........I really do feel sorry for you man.

    ORIGINAL: chrisco954
    Lance has been tested and tested and tested and you still think that a baby was born with a wooden leg


    So what if he's been tested? Less than 1% of tests in athletes turn up a positive, do you believe that less that 1% of athletes use performance enhancing drugs?
    #4
    wolf97
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 03:42:00 (permalink)
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    Lance is clean and one of the greatest pure athletes, physically and mentally thats is alive (and has ever lived).
    #5
    APB
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 03:53:50 (permalink)
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    chrisco954, PaulSF and wolf97 - You wanna buy a bridge off me?



    You can take it off my hands for £1000 cash up front.
    #6
    eGGz
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 04:13:27 (permalink)
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    Watched an interview with lance A last summer. He said that his resting heartrate was 30 BPM. Or once every two seconds. That alone is impressive to me, not to mention his accomplishments.

    If he uses anything he and his team surely are smart enough to not get caught.
    #7
    Grendel
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 05:17:35 (permalink)
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    This argument is useless as only lance and god know if he's ever doped, no one here can say they know for sure, unless maybe an X is on here (whom one did state that she had helped him inject) whether it is true is again up to her, lance and god, and I cannot stand whole-heartedly on either side of this fence and fight to the death for the sake of an unprovable argument (as we all know there are ways to beat the system) Even if he did, lots of guys juice and still never did what he has done... so regardless he remains an anomaly, hats off to the man, he's a tough son of b!tch either way

    ~Grendel~
    #8
    Genics
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 05:34:14 (permalink)
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    total bs, the man is doped up to his eyeblals i dont give a a **** who thins other wise. no way can the rest of the cyclist be jucied to the gills and still not be able to touch armstrong and he is "natural" pull the other one. tetsing dont mean ****.

    "He who dies biggest, WINS!"- MonstaDwarf


    #9
    drab4
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 06:19:23 (permalink)
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    ORIGINAL: omnigate

    what would an endurance athelete's cycle/stack look like?

    Low dose test or other steroids (not huge doses). EPO (along with assorted meds). GH. Stimulants (eg salbutamol etc).

    As for any individual cyclist, no one here knows exactly what they are using. If anyone here did know then they would be a close friend of that cyclist, and so would not talk about it on a public forum.

    In general, it's thought that pro cyclists are quite heavy users of performance enhancing drugs.
    #10
    sillynarbie
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 07:11:01 (permalink)
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    I love the way people just biblically believe he is clean without knowing anything about the sport?

    Drug use in cycling is RIFE, and if you can believe that lance armstrong doesn't take drugs despite the fact that people on every drug known to man can't even touch him, then you are very very naive. There are riders with greater power to weight ratios, greater anaerobic thresholds, and greater VO2max figures than lance, that take drugs, and still can't get anywhere near him. I for one don't know how this is possible, I'm not going to say lance does or doesn't cheat, cuz I simply don't know, i'll just say it woudln't surprise me at all if he did.

    There are no tests for many of the drugs they take, there is a rubbish test for EPO, which can detect it to an extent for a few days after use, but its pretty useless to be honest. The only other test is a haematocrit test, which can be a sign for doping, but people rarely fail that(only 2 of this years tour riders did as far as I know?)


    That link that APB gave, you'd think that after that discovery and the ensuing crackdown on drugs in cycling, that next years tour de france would be slower than previous years wouldn't you? Well, think again, it was faster, and by a long way.

    Most of these riders ride in excess of 1000km every week for training, it would come close to killing most of us, I know somebody who tried it, a keen cyclist I might add, whos been cycling for many years, just for 1 week, to cycle 1000km, he ended up in hospital and couldn't do anything for 3 months, couldn't work, cycle, nothing!!

    Like I said, I don't know if lance does or doesn't cheat, but to be honest I find it hard to believe he doesn't.


    #11
    Zircon
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 08:47:02 (permalink)
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    I think it's a combination of factors.

    I think his training is somewhat unique and extremely closely monitored, day by day, by doctors and managers who know everything there is to know, not only about the human body, but also about Lance. I also think recovery techniques that are used are very advanced. Cryotherapy, altitude/oxygen tents, and possibly (I'm guessing) some kind of blood dialysis that can rid his body of exercise by products after training, allowing him to train hard again the next day.

    Secondly his cancer, suffering and general mental ability does give him an edge, "all things being equal". All thinks being equal, I must hint towards that he is using something that everyone else is using, low dose test, epo, hgh. But from that standpoint he is making himself one step above anyone else, by his training, attitude and mental strength.

    I think he uses it like everyone else, and yet I have great respect for this man.
    #12
    lubo1916
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 09:43:39 (permalink)
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    I remember smoking a spliff whilst on my Rayleigh Grifter, pure mentle man...
    #13
    matsu
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 10:04:22 (permalink)
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    APB....thats a bit cheap mate! selling our heirlooms off is very unpatriotic!

    and love that connoly quote!!!

    clean or not ......... give the man his kudos!!! there is life after cancer! YOU GOTTA BE IN THE RACE TO WIN IT. this is a steroid forum so why are we arguing about it???

    and he.s shagging sheryl crow!!!!!!!! lucky SOB!!


    go lance!!

    matsu

    do not mistake my kindness for weakness!!
    #14
    DonVito
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 13:16:20 (permalink)
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    This is quite i hot topic, i personnlay think he is clean but who knows what he maybe taking. Maybe hes just trying to be an inspiration to people who currently have cancer or who have had cancer. Just goes to show how unique the human body really is juiced or not juiced, either way this man has trainned his ass off. It takes alot for someone to pick them selves up from having such what could be a life threatening disease, then win the tour de france what 7 times!!!!
    post edited by DonVito - 2005/08/03 13:17:45

    "Oh!! Thats your Boyfriend, i thought you were tallking your little brother for a walk.."
    #15
    Dirtbox
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 13:17:28 (permalink)
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    I couldnt care less who juices & who doesnt!!

    Im just happy there are some trees left in the world!

    Peace
    #16
    Genics
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 14:50:50 (permalink)
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    how cant i ebnch a 100lbs...? and you really dont have a clue when you talk about my personal situation as there is alot of **** i didnt post in that jounral so keep your gums shut. and my credibility is fine and im sure most on this forum would agree with that.

    "He who dies biggest, WINS!"- MonstaDwarf


    #17
    ihawk
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 15:06:15 (permalink)
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    what a waste of time these posts are, no one actually knows if he is clean except him and a few very close to him, if he was clean he would indeed be without doubt the most gifted and accomplished athlete that ever lived, to be able to take on everyone else while they use huge quantities of gear would indeed be an amzeing and imo unlikely feat.

    any athlete that doesnt dope at the top level is imo an idiot or one of a tiny minority that have a strong moral opposing view point and 1 in 100,000,000 genetics.

    any one of us that believes drug testing is effective is imo an idiot, there are countless substances that as yet can still not be tested for even now human growth hormone can still not be reliably tested for, that is without examining closely the politics of drug use and the huge impact of genuine ruthless testing where 95% of athletes at the top level would be caught and the level of performance would take a big step back.

    so did lance dope? couldnt say for a fact but imo he would have needed to to be competative. does this make him a bad person? no because imo he would be doing exactly what everyone else did and so it was an even playing field.

    Genics you are alright by me mate.

    and chris does the fact that i am bigger and stronger than you make my point any more valid or was it infact totally irrelevant to the post?
    #18
    lilguy43
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 16:06:51 (permalink)
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    "If you cheat and lose, chest til you win." SO\ome live by this statement I personaly hate it. Is being on gear cheating? I don't think so. I think that the use of performance enhancing drugs should be up to the athlete and not the people who run it.

    Either way who cares he won and thats it. great athlete if he is on or off, period!!!
    #19
    Zircon
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    RE: Lance Armstrong 2005/08/03 16:22:39 (permalink)
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    If they decided that gear use is illegal, then gear use is cheating. The point is it is supposed to be a level playing field, but it isn't. I compete against athletes taking ****, so I would be stupid to think I can compete with them professionaly without to some extent joining them. I think the same goes for Lance. All I know is that mentally and physically he deeserves it more than anyone else there, IF they are all on level playing fields (which I'm not sur eof).

    Anyway, I've joined the dark side, so I'll see how it goes.
    #20
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