YB
BannerBanner

When did you try DS/PH?

Author
will
New Member
  • Total Posts : 20
  • Reward points: 286
  • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
  • Status: offline
2008/05/19 12:25:20 (permalink)
0

When did you try DS/PH?


Just wondering. For those of you who have tried a DS/PH, how long had you trained with just none or basic supplementation (ie. protein and/or creatine) before your first dabble with DS/PH, and what were your thoughts after your cycle?

I've seen people say that you should first reach your natural limit, but I don't see how you could determine when that was. Is there any detrimental effect (scientifically) to cycling a DS/PH in your 1st year of training?

From the research I've done over the past couple of months, it would appear that Epistane (and it's clones) seems to be the best choice for a 1st DS/PH due to the ratio of gains-to-sides (ie. the majority of reports/logs seem to indicate a high occurence of low to almost zero sides).

thanks for reading :)
#1

14 Replies Related Threads

    Spartan82
    Olympian Member
    • Total Posts : 602
    • Reward points: 8215
    • Joined: 2008/01/07 21:45:09
    • Location: UK
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 12:47:22 (permalink)
    0
    I trained for 9 years before trying DS/PH. I only decided to try a DS after realising i had reached my natural limit.

    I have tried H-Drol which i gained 9lbs over 4 weeks and kept 5lbs after PCT

    I am currently a week into my Epidrol cycle and have put on 5lbs and strength is going up

    For a first cycle i would recommend H-Drol but firstly what are your stats and also how old are you?
    #2
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 13:18:32 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: Spartan82

    I trained for 9 years before trying DS/PH. I only decided to try a DS after realising i had reached my natural limit.

    I have tried H-Drol which i gained 9lbs over 4 weeks and kept 5lbs after PCT

    I am currently a week into my Epidrol cycle and have put on 5lbs and strength is going up

    For a first cycle i would recommend H-Drol but firstly what are your stats and also how old are you?


    Thanks for the reply.

    I'm 36, 5'11 and 84kg ish (depending on dinner )

    I'm not personally looking to try DS/PH. I'm just interested in other peoples experiences. Thats not to say I won't rule out trying a cycle ever. I have trained on and off (mostly off!) for a number of years. At present, I've been back training since xmas and am making good gains so am happy with just protein although I've just ordered some CEL n-Crease to go with it.

    With your h-drol cycle did you use a serm with your pct? I guess what I find strange is people saying use a serm with Epi when it's been proven to be a decent anti-estrogen drug itself. I'm intrigued to know how you could get gyno from just an Epi cycle?
    #3
    neil19
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 1
    • Reward points: 180
    • Joined: 2008/05/19 11:08:21
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 14:25:54 (permalink)
    0
    as n e 1 herd ov tri-bolic n e info wud help and can n e 1 tel me wot pct is thanx
    #4
    sullivan0785
    Senior Member
    • Total Posts : 248
    • Reward points: 4545
    • Joined: 2006/11/10 23:50:25
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 14:31:43 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: will


    ORIGINAL: Spartan82

    I trained for 9 years before trying DS/PH. I only decided to try a DS after realising i had reached my natural limit.

    I have tried H-Drol which i gained 9lbs over 4 weeks and kept 5lbs after PCT

    I am currently a week into my Epidrol cycle and have put on 5lbs and strength is going up

    For a first cycle i would recommend H-Drol but firstly what are your stats and also how old are you?


    Thanks for the reply.

    I'm 36, 5'11 and 84kg ish (depending on dinner )

    I'm not personally looking to try DS/PH. I'm just interested in other peoples experiences. Thats not to say I won't rule out trying a cycle ever. I have trained on and off (mostly off!) for a number of years. At present, I've been back training since xmas and am making good gains so am happy with just protein although I've just ordered some CEL n-Crease to go with it.

    With your h-drol cycle did you use a serm with your pct? I guess what I find strange is people saying use a serm with Epi when it's been proven to be a decent anti-estrogen drug itself. I'm intrigued to know how you could get gyno from just an Epi cycle?


    Hi Will, Im 24 and have been training seriously for almost 5 years. When I was 22 I dabled with my first ever steroid, Superdrol. I Realized i haven't reached my natural limit but was looking for that extra boost and SD did that. The reason behind a SERM is that when you use a steroid like Superdrol, H-drol, Epidrol. Your HPTA gets shutdown when you come off cycle. Which means your testosterone levels drop and estrogen rises. With a compound like Epi, It has the anti-estrogen qualities, However it still plummets youe natural test levels. A SERM like Nolva or Clomid for instance can help restore natural test and limit the rise in estrogen.

    One year ago i developed gyno behind both nipples from a cycle of SD. Nolva did nothing in helping for i believe i reacted to late. Year later I hit my first ever cycle of Epi. After the cycle i gained a total of 12lbs and best of all the Epi cleared my gyno problem. I was ready to set a date for surgery. I am so very greatful, and thank god everyday. I believe it was a sign, and since I am cautious of what ever enters my body.

    "Being a man when you don't have to is just a waste of testosterone"

    Email: Psullivan0785@hotmail.com
    #5
    ed1coupe
    Olympian Member
    • Total Posts : 807
    • Reward points: 7776
    • Joined: 2004/08/27 12:53:45
    • Location: London United Kingdom
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 14:33:20 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: neil19

    as n e 1 herd ov tri-bolic n e info wud help and can n e 1 tel me wot pct is thanx


    Learn to speak English, man, not this gibberish.

    Use the search facility for opinions on this; I would suggest it's not something you should be thinking about trying just yet!
    #6
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 15:25:25 (permalink)
    0
    ORIGINAL: sullivan0785


    ORIGINAL: will


    ORIGINAL: Spartan82

    I trained for 9 years before trying DS/PH. I only decided to try a DS after realising i had reached my natural limit.

    I have tried H-Drol which i gained 9lbs over 4 weeks and kept 5lbs after PCT

    I am currently a week into my Epidrol cycle and have put on 5lbs and strength is going up

    For a first cycle i would recommend H-Drol but firstly what are your stats and also how old are you?


    Thanks for the reply.

    I'm 36, 5'11 and 84kg ish (depending on dinner )

    I'm not personally looking to try DS/PH. I'm just interested in other peoples experiences. Thats not to say I won't rule out trying a cycle ever. I have trained on and off (mostly off!) for a number of years. At present, I've been back training since xmas and am making good gains so am happy with just protein although I've just ordered some CEL n-Crease to go with it.

    With your h-drol cycle did you use a serm with your pct? I guess what I find strange is people saying use a serm with Epi when it's been proven to be a decent anti-estrogen drug itself. I'm intrigued to know how you could get gyno from just an Epi cycle?


    Hi Will, Im 24 and have been training seriously for almost 5 years. When I was 22 I dabled with my first ever steroid, Superdrol. I Realized i haven't reached my natural limit but was looking for that extra boost and SD did that. The reason behind a SERM is that when you use a steroid like Superdrol, H-drol, Epidrol. Your HPTA gets shutdown when you come off cycle. Which means your testosterone levels drop and estrogen rises. With a compound like Epi, It has the anti-estrogen qualities, However it still plummets youe natural test levels. A SERM like Nolva or Clomid for instance can help restore natural test and limit the rise in estrogen.

    One year ago i developed gyno behind both nipples from a cycle of SD. Nolva did nothing in helping for i believe i reacted to late. Year later I hit my first ever cycle of Epi. After the cycle i gained a total of 12lbs and best of all the Epi cleared my gyno problem. I was ready to set a date for surgery. I am so very greatful, and thank god everyday. I believe it was a sign, and since I am cautious of what ever enters my body.


    Thanks for that - some good information there. You aren't the only person that I have read that has seen gyno-reduction/removal from Epi, so to me it sounds like Epi really can be quite safe (in terms of gyno).

    So, for something anti-estrogenic like Epi, wouldn't a simple test-boost supplement during PCT be just as valid (if not moreso) than running clomid/nolva/torem? Also, at 10/20/30/40mg on a 4wk cycle, can Epi shut you down? (or is that entirely dependent on the individual?).

    post edited by will - 2008/05/19 15:26:34
    #7
    sullivan0785
    Senior Member
    • Total Posts : 248
    • Reward points: 4545
    • Joined: 2006/11/10 23:50:25
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 16:51:13 (permalink)
    0


    You would be taking a chance in not using a SERM in your PCT. Of course you could always run Cissus along side with Nolva/Clomid. However, a SERM is a must. It can all depend on the individual but Epi will most likely shut you down a pretty good amount when coming off. Are you from the UK or states Will?



    "Being a man when you don't have to is just a waste of testosterone"

    Email: Psullivan0785@hotmail.com
    #8
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 17:26:04 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: sullivan0785



    You would be taking a chance in not using a SERM in your PCT. Of course you could always run Cissus along side with Nolva/Clomid. However, a SERM is a must. It can all depend on the individual but Epi will most likely shut you down a pretty good amount when coming off. Are you from the UK or states Will?



    I guess I'd be really interested to see someones blood work after a course of Epi. I really think that would help to cement the value of a serm (for an Epi only cycle), over that of an OTC PCT. I certainly hear where you are coming from though, and without seeing blood work, I would have to agree - better to be safe than sorry. I'm from the UK.

    #9
    Spartan82
    Olympian Member
    • Total Posts : 602
    • Reward points: 8215
    • Joined: 2008/01/07 21:45:09
    • Location: UK
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 17:30:14 (permalink)
    0


    With your h-drol cycle did you use a serm with your pct? I guess what I find strange is people saying use a serm with Epi when it's been proven to be a decent anti-estrogen drug itself. I'm intrigued to know how you could get gyno from just an Epi cycle?



    Yes i used Nolva after my H-Drol cycle.

    Even though Epi has anti-estrogen properties there is still a chance of developing gyno after your cycle.

    As sullivan0785 has stated a SERM is a must with any DS/PH cycle if you are to get the most from the product
    #10
    stavross
    Pro-Member
    • Total Posts : 4798
    • Reward points: 3975
    • Joined: 2004/08/30 22:02:32
    • Location: United Kingdom
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 17:58:57 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: will


    Just wondering. For those of you who have tried a DS/PH, how long had you trained with just none or basic supplementation (ie. protein and/or creatine) before your first dabble with DS/PH, and what were your thoughts after your cycle?

    I've seen people say that you should first reach your natural limit, but I don't see how you could determine when that was. Is there any detrimental effect (scientifically) to cycling a DS/PH in your 1st year of training?


    I trained with basic food/supplements for about four years before a did my first superdrol cycle. I doubt i was near my genetic limit but i was fed up with bustin my ass week in week out and seeing minimal gains in size. I know the key is to eat more but i would get fat when i did that rather than just put on muscle which is what i wanted to do.
    I did 2 cycles pretty much back to back like this:
    1-3 Webber Oxodrol
    4-5 Designer Supp's NHA stack
    6-10 ALRI e...max LMG
    nolva and rebound xt for pct. also won a free vial of igf 1 so used that in pct too.

    I was very happy with the results, i put on about 20lb (mix of fat and muscle obviously) everyone i knew said i looked much bigger which was nice and i gained a fair bit of strength.
    #11
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 18:02:34 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: Spartan82



    With your h-drol cycle did you use a serm with your pct? I guess what I find strange is people saying use a serm with Epi when it's been proven to be a decent anti-estrogen drug itself. I'm intrigued to know how you could get gyno from just an Epi cycle?



    Yes i used Nolva after my H-Drol cycle.

    Even though Epi has anti-estrogen properties there is still a chance of developing gyno after your cycle.

    As sullivan0785 has stated a SERM is a must with any DS/PH cycle if you are to get the most from the product


    See thats what I don't get about Epi. There are lots of logs where people have come forward to say how Epi has cleared up their Gyno. I can't see how Epi alone can *induce* it, given it's make up. I can see the issue of possible suppression and therefore the requirement of a test-booster, but getting gyno from Epi - I just can't see it. At this point I'd like to make it clear that I know fcuk all about chemistry, although I used to enjoy setting fire to things with bunsen burners.
    #12
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 18:05:40 (permalink)
    0

    another question...

    Do you think a cycle of DS/PH, *if taken correctly and with an appropriate pct*, would not be beneficial to someone who had trained for only, say 1 year.

    If you don't think it would be of any use / detrimental, please could you say why?

    cheers
    #13
    will
    New Member
    • Total Posts : 20
    • Reward points: 286
    • Joined: 2008/03/27 14:34:54
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 18:07:24 (permalink)
    0

    ORIGINAL: stavross


    ORIGINAL: will


    Just wondering. For those of you who have tried a DS/PH, how long had you trained with just none or basic supplementation (ie. protein and/or creatine) before your first dabble with DS/PH, and what were your thoughts after your cycle?

    I've seen people say that you should first reach your natural limit, but I don't see how you could determine when that was. Is there any detrimental effect (scientifically) to cycling a DS/PH in your 1st year of training?


    I trained with basic food/supplements for about four years before a did my first superdrol cycle. I doubt i was near my genetic limit but i was fed up with bustin my ass week in week out and seeing minimal gains in size. I know the key is to eat more but i would get fat when i did that rather than just put on muscle which is what i wanted to do.
    I did 2 cycles pretty much back to back like this:
    1-3 Webber Oxodrol
    4-5 Designer Supp's NHA stack
    6-10 ALRI e...max LMG
    nolva and rebound xt for pct. also won a free vial of igf 1 so used that in pct too.

    I was very happy with the results, i put on about 20lb (mix of fat and muscle obviously) everyone i knew said i looked much bigger which was nice and i gained a fair bit of strength.

    four years before a did my first superdrol cycle. I doubt i was near my genetic limit but i was fed up with bustin


    Thanks Stavross - do you think, knowing what you know now, that you would have done that cycle earlier than 4yrs in?
    #14
    stavross
    Pro-Member
    • Total Posts : 4798
    • Reward points: 3975
    • Joined: 2004/08/30 22:02:32
    • Location: United Kingdom
    • Status: offline
    RE: When did you try DS/PH? 2008/05/19 18:07:45 (permalink)
    0
    Setting fire to things with bunsen burners is cool.

    The thing with hormones is that the ballance in your body is pretty delicate so when you use a steroid (even a gyno killing one) you tip the ballance and once you finish your cycle the hormonal ballance is still slopped one way or the other. Stuff like this can result in side effects which range from acne to gyno or hair loss.

    The other thing to remember is that using a serm for pct is not just about avoiding gyno, it's design is to restore natural testosterone production. A SERM does this better than an OTC AI.
    #15
    Jump to:
    ©2018 All content is copyright of MuscleTalk.co.uk and its use elsewhere is prohibited.
    (posting guidelines | privacy | advertise | earnings disclaimer | contact us | supported by)
    © 2018 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.5